desktop April 2020

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18 participants
26 discussions

Fedora Workstation WG minutes, April 28
by Michael Catanzaro 05 May '20

05 May '20

Fedora Workstation WG meeting Minutes should be digestible by Meetbot ( https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:Guide#MeetBot_Commands ) Minutes #startmeeting Workstation WG (2020-04-28) #meetingname workstation #chair cmurf #topic Rollcall #info present: cmurf, tpopela, aday, mclasen, otaylor, mcatanzaro, jens, kalev, james, feborges, link #info regrets: neal #info missing: langdon #topic Approve minutes of 14 & 21 April #link https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-2/2020-04-21/workstation.2… #link https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-2/2020-04-24/workstation.2… #agreed Approved - no objections #topic Announcements F32 release day Fedora on Lenovo laptops; potential implications for the working group: #link https://fedoramagazine.org/coming-soon-fedora-on-lenovo-laptops/ - First boot (initial setup as the first thing the user sees, rather than Anaconda) - need to ensure that either language selection is displayed in initial setup or ensure that the correct keyboard layout is predefined for the locale. Some digging required here. It might be good to track that. - ACTION: Michael to investigate. - Disk encryption - how to enable/reprovision? #topic Status reports Chris is 60% through swap on zram proposal; is currently summarising the hibernation issue #topic F32 retrospective, and appoint chair for F33 cycle #link https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/141 #info Review F32 cycle, WG organizational and meeting format changes. Chair and co-chair nominations. #topic Meeting format Chris would appreciate feedback on the meeting format. Michael: thinks that things are going well. Thinks that video has been a success. 6 month chair seems good; thinks that Chris has been doing a good job. Allan: posted his feedback in the ticket (as did Chris and Tomas). Kalev: not happy at all. Would prefer IRC meetings. Chris: could we have an IRC meeting every month? Kalev: or a video meeting every month, and IRC at other times? Matthias: we have IRC all the time. Non-weekly meetings are difficult, calendar-wise. #agreed Continue the discussion on the ticket. #topic Chair/co-chair duration Kalev: 6 months is too long; would prefer 2/3 months, and the chair can choose the meeting format Chris: perhaps that suggestion could be combined with Allan's idea of the chair delegating more duties #topic Nominations Chris would be happy to do it, and perhaps delegate more Allan is happy to carry on as co-chair, would quite like not to do the minutes any more Allan: we have some long-running initiatives which Chris has been leading, which it would be good to resolve for F33. Chris: isn't sure he needs to be chair for that. Michael is happy for Chris to carry on as chair. So is Allan. Chris invites others to put themselves forward as nominees. Kalev is interested, but only if we use IRC. Would change the direction - would focus on getting Flathub preinstalled instead of disk encryption. Also which apps are preinstalled. Some discussion about enabling Flathub by default - see ticket #108 #topic Encryption of system and user data #link https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/136 #link https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/82 Discuss short term encryption plan (full disk encryption as it exists today in the installer, which encrypts both system and user data). Last week Lennart and Ray joined us to talk about homed. Ray might report back next week on systemd-homed. It's currently unclear whether systemd-homed is a short-term prospect or a long-term prospect. Question about setting up recovery keys - https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/136#comment-643926 Michael & Matthias: how is a recovery password useful, if you can just forget that one as well? Owen: the fact that it's a recovery password indicates to people that they need a good record of it. Allan: would like to evaluate the full range of issues/requirements in relation to full disk encryption, not just this issue alone. How does this approach to password recovery compare to other approaches? Michael: we should invite people from fedora-devel to participate in the discussion. #action: michael to do this. Jens: what about root password? (as recovery key?) #topic Blocking on user switching #link https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/139 What are the parameters by which loss of function should or should not be release blocking? Is it right to block a release on this? Kalev: yes. We have the engineers to fix it. Matthias: depends on how relevant user switching is to us. Allan: there are some multiuser cases where it would be nice if Fedora was appropriate - small labs/offices. Kalev: shared computers at home are relevant too. Allan: other question is how bad the fail state is - does it just not work, or does it bring down the session/system, etc? #agreed User switching should be a release blocker; we're happy for QA to decide on the exact wording. #action Chris to communicate the decision to QA #topic Workstation Live image is oversize #link https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/140 Chris: what's the process we want to determine the image size? Kalev: if we want to stick to 2GB, we will need to cut some packages. We're very close to the limit - not much room for manoeuvre. Owen: if we change the limit to 4GB, we wouldn't have any other process to keep the size down. This could imply that we should only increase the limit a small amount. The alternative would be to schedule a size review each development cycle. Matthias: it could be a package review rather than size review - to see what changes have been made. Kalev: it would be good to do this around the same time as the test day. Owen: that might not give us a lot of time to resolve engineering issues. Kalev: yes, we should have the test day before the beta, to give us enough time before the beta release. Chris: would like to review which services are started, too. #action Chris will ask release engineering and QA for their input, and we'll work out the details next week #topic Guidelines for preinstalled and non-removable apps #link https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/125 #info Deferred #endmeeting

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5 May, MEETING AGENDA
by Chris Murphy 04 May '20

04 May '20

Workstation Working Group Meeting Date and Time: 2020-05-05 9:30 am ET 13:30 UTC Location: https://bluejeans.com/395383051/ https://www.bluejeans.com/numbers == Agenda == - Approve 28 Apr minutes https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-2/2020-04-30/workstation.2… - Announcements - Follow-ups - Topics #82 encryption of user data (excludes system) https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/82 Tentative, pending guest availability. #125 Guidelines for preinstalled and non-removable apps https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/125#comment-644039 #141 F32 retrospective, and appoint chair for F33 cycle https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/141 Openfloor -- Chris Murphy

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Blocking on user switching: redux
by Adam Williamson 28 Apr '20

28 Apr '20

Hi folks! So, during Fedora 32 Final blocker review, a bug relating to "user switching" came up for review: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1817708 I dug into the question of whether we have tended to consider the "log in / log out / shut down / reboot" criterion as covering user switching, and found that this issue is actually kinda outstanding and unresolved for a long time. Back in January 2015, we kinda provisionally decided that we *did* want to block on user switching bugs, by accepting this one as a blocker during a review meeting: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1184933 kparal was detailed to propose clearly adding it to the criteria, and he duly drafted up a change and mailed it to the relevant lists - test@, kde@ and desktop@: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2015-January/124811.html https://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/kde/2015-January/014175.html https://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/desktop/2015-January/011558.html However, here things foundered a bit because there was some opposition to the idea. The discussion is spread across the three lists, but my reading is broadly that there were distinct camps in favour of and against blocking on user switching bugs. Prominent "pro-blocking" folks were Michael Catanzaro and Kevin Kofler. Prominent "anti-blocking" folks were Matthias Clasen, Rex Dieter and Josh Boyer. Obviously that's a particularly awkward split because we have pro- and anti- folks on both the desktop and KDE teams. The discussion was pretty active, but in the end it sort of petered out without any definite conclusion being reached. The draft changes Kamil proposed were never made, and the criterion remained as it was before. For the purposes of our specific F32 blocker proposal we decided to adopt the principle that, since there was a discussion that clearly did not reach a consensus that user switching *should* be release-blocking, we could not really treat it as such, and thus we rejected the bug as a blocker. But I figured it would probably be a good idea to bring the topic up again and try to come to a definite conclusion this time. So, once again: do we think it makes sense to consider desktop user switching - that is, switching between multiple active desktop sessions for different users, without logging out and in - as release-blocking? Has anyone who was active in the previous discussion changed their mind on this? I suppose one question that could potentially arise is whether we could treat it as release-blocking for GNOME but not for KDE, or vice versa. In general I think it's a good goal to try and keep our standards similar across our release-blocking desktops, but I do think we could at least consider that, if the discussion seemed to be going in that direction. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net

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[Fedocal] Reminder meeting : Workstation WG
by catanzaro＠fedoraproject.org 27 Apr '20

27 Apr '20

Dear all, You are kindly invited to the meeting: Workstation WG on 2020-04-28 from 09:30:00 to 10:30:00 US/Eastern At https://bluejeans.com/395383051/ The meeting will be about: Regular meeting for the Workstation Working Group Current Topics: https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issues?status=Open&tags=meeting Etherpad: https://etherpad.gnome.org/p/fedora-workstation-wg More information available at: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Workstation Source: https://apps.fedoraproject.org/calendar/meeting/9652/

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28 Apr, MEETING AGENDA
by Chris Murphy 27 Apr '20

27 Apr '20

Workstation Working Group Meeting Date and Time: 2020-04-28 9:30 am ET 13:30 UTC Location: https://bluejeans.com/395383051/ https://www.bluejeans.com/numbers Note: At the last meeting, we were joined by Lennart Poettering and Ray Strode, for a systemd-homed discussion. This was cut short, but will be continued, tentatively set for 5 May. == Agenda == - Approve 14 Apr and 21 Apr minutes https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-2/2020-04-21/workstation.2… https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-2/2020-04-24/workstation.2… - Announcements - Status reports - Topics #141 F32 retrospective, and appoint chair for F33 cycle https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/141 Review F32 cycle, WG organizational and meeting format changes. Chair and co-chair nominations. --- #136 encryption of system data (excludes user) https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/136 #82 encryption of user data (excludes system) https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/82 Discuss short term encryption plan (full disk encryption as it exists today in the installer, which encrypts both system and user data). --- #139 Blocking on user switching https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/139 What are the parameters by which loss of function should or should not be release blocking? --- #140 Workstation Live image is oversize https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/136 --- #125 Guidelines for preinstalled and non-removable apps https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/125 -- Chris Murphy

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Update for f32-backgrounds
by Luya Tshimbalanga 25 Apr '20

25 Apr '20

An updated f32-backgrounds 32.1.4 will be available after Fedora 32 release for addressing the zoom issue related to the default static backgrounds. With some input from spin maintainers, the symbolic link for the default background is fixed. https://bodhi.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2020-717e28aadb -- Luya Tshimbalanga Fedora Design Team Fedora Design Suite maintainer

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RE: [Design-team] F32 Artwork wiki page
by Máirín Duffy 25 Apr '20

25 Apr '20

Looks great! Thanks Luya!!! ~mSent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone. -------- Original message --------From: Luya Tshimbalanga <luya(a)fedoraproject.org> Date: 4/25/20 3:29 PM (GMT-05:00) To: Fedora Design Team <design-team(a)lists.fedoraproject.org> Cc: desktop(a)lists.fedoraproject.org Subject: [Design-team] F32 Artwork wiki page Hello team,Here is the wiki page for f32-backgrounds.https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F32_Artwork-- Luya TshimbalangaFedora Design TeamFedora Design Suite maintainer_______________________________________________design-team mailing list -- design-team(a)lists.fedoraproject.orgTo unsubscribe send an email to design-team-leave(a)lists.fedoraproject.orgFedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelinesList Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/design-team@lists.fedoraproje…

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F32 Artwork wiki page
by Luya Tshimbalanga 25 Apr '20

25 Apr '20

Hello team, Here is the wiki page for f32-backgrounds. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F32_Artwork -- Luya Tshimbalanga Fedora Design Team Fedora Design Suite maintainer

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Fedora Workstation WG minutes, 21 April
by Allan Day 24 Apr '20

24 Apr '20

The summary and minutes of this week's Fedora Workstation Working Group meeting can be read here: https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-2/2020-04-24/workstation.2… Thanks, Allan

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Fedora Workstation WG minutes, 14 April
by Allan Day 21 Apr '20

21 Apr '20

The summary and minutes of last week's Workstation Working Group meeting can be found here: https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-2/2020-04-21/workstation.2… Allan

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desktop April 2020