[snip]
BTW, we must decide wether Fedora (core+extras(+livna)) should be self-containing, or if it should be as easy as possible to use as a platform for 3. party programs. I think it should be made as easy as possible to use as a platform, and not depend on the "all programs MUST come from RH/extras or they ar EVIL!" thinking we are seeing now...
then a lot of third part packagers should do a better job of packaging. myself included.