docs May 2008

docs@lists.stg.fedoraproject.org

28 participants
53 discussions

Does not validate
by Marc Wiriadisastra 19 May '08

19 May '08

For some reason I'm getting the following error in the F-8 directory for the DuG. Document /home/marc/fedora-cvs/docs/desktop-user-guide/F-8/en_US/desktop-user-guide.xml does not validate This is when I'm trying to compile a html version to view possible improvements. Any suggestions would be great. Cheers, Marc

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Magazine article
by Paul W. Frields 18 May '08

18 May '08

The opportunity's come up to have a contributor write for a Linux newsstand publication -- an 8-9 page article covering installation and simple beginning configuration for Fedora 9. The article can contain some screenshots of the kind normally found in these types of publications. This requires a person to *commit* to have the article ready by around June 15th. Kara and I will get you hooked up with the magazine publishers for all the details, which are between you and the publication's editors. This is a great chance for someone to get involved with publicizing Fedora 9 in a way that is guaranteed to reach thousands of readers. Interested? Get in touch with me or Kara offline. -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug

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translation quick start guide
by Sulyok Peti 18 May '08

18 May '08

Did you noticed, that DSA SSH keys are not accepted in FAS, only RSA keys? Just because the translation quick start guide gives examples with DSA keys. And it mentiones kbabel instead of the new name kaider.

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Fedora 9 release notes: final updates
by Murray McAllister 17 May '08

17 May '08

Hi, The last lot of zero-day Fedora 9 web-only release notes updates have been committed to CVS. These will also become part of the fedora-release-notes-9.0.2-1 package. A summary of the changes: * OverView.xml: A new section on PreUpgrade has been added, as well as a small change, "Firefox 3" to "Firefox 3 (beta 5)". * Desktop.xml: - more information added to 10.1.2. GNOME Display Manager. - a new, very small section, 10.3. PackageKit, has been added. - minor changes and removals (for example, an "x86_64" was removed). - a small section, 10.6.1. NSpluginwrapper, has been added. - minor content and new command have been added to 10.6.2. Enabling Flash Plugin. - a new section, 10.7. Mail Clients, has been added. Since it is the weekend, I pushed the final time and date for translation submissions to UTC 2359, 2008-05-21, which will give everyone an extra day over the original schedule. Thank you all very much again for all of your tireless efforts! Apologies if any of the above details are incorrect, or if I have left something out. Kind Regards, Murray.

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Security Guide: Encryption Chapter ready for editing
by Eric Christensen 16 May '08

16 May '08

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The Encryption chapter [1] of the Security Guide is ready for editing. I want to clean it up more but I don't want to hold up the entire publication on it. Thanks, Eric [1] http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs/Drafts/CryptoGuide/Encryption -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIKvHdL5V8yddJCO0RAgShAJ4hEdKxq3HfqxbhfIIY0ImB9QxZzwCfdUVg nw6VSbi0YFCGL6eMhx7xphI= =qJYo -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Self Introduction - Jon Stanley
by Jon Stanley 16 May '08

16 May '08

Hey, Paul inspired me to write down some of my blog posts on how to do various QA tasks in Fedora as documentation :). So here I am. For the formal self-intro: My name Jon Stanley. For my day job, I'm a IT Architect at a large-ish IT service provider. I live in Jersey City, NJ USA (part of the NYC metro area). What I already do in Fedora is to co-lead the bug triage team with John Poelstra, participate in various marketing activities, maintain a few fonts, do QA, etc. My goals for the documentation project include developing documentation around the various tools that are used for the QA and distribution composition function within Fedora. These tools are in the open, however, they're largely undocumented, which has the effect of deterring people from using them. My skill level with Linux and Fedora is extensive - I'm a RHCE (805007017527115) and have one RHCA exam under my belt. I'm always looking to learn more, however! :). My GPG key fingerprint is below: pub 1024D/1F85118D 2007-12-16 Key fingerprint = 84A5 3E8C 66E7 53B3 C029 33B8 7111 2949 1F85 118D uid Jon Stanley <jonstanley(a)gmail.com> sub 2048g/FD723FBD 2007-12-16 I may need some stylistic help in my documentation, and DocBook is a new and scary thing to me, but I'm sure I can learn. Look forward to working with everyone!

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release notes for preupgrade
by Murray McAllister 15 May '08

15 May '08

Hi, Should there be any mention in the release notes about where to get preupgrade from? If so, what is the 'official' location? Cheers, Murray. --------------------------------------------------------------------- pub 1024D/81B3FDEB 2007-09-19 [expires: 2008-09-18] Key fingerprint = 4ED9 9907 5BF0 4132 2B46 20D1 C0C6 362D 81B3 FDEB Murray McAllister (Fedora Docs Project / mdious) <murray.mcallister(a)gmail.com> sub 2048g/B04CFA0C 2007-09-19 [expires: 2008-09-18]

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FDSCo Meeting 2008-05-14 IRC log
by Karsten Wade 14 May '08

14 May '08

HTML log: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/DocsProject/SteeringCommittee/Meetings/Minute… 12:03 < quaid> <meeting> 12:03 -!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: FDSCo hanging out -- roll call and opening howdies, then congratulations and all that on another fine release, the kittens are safe once again 12:03 < quaid> I is still here 12:04 < jmbuser> JohnBabich 12:04 < Sparks> EricChristensen 12:04 < jsmith> JaredSmith (present but brain-dead) 12:04 -!- glezos [n=glezos@fedora/glezos] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:05 < quaid> glezos is here too I rekcon 12:05 < stickster> PaulFrields 12:05 < quaid> so, howdy, everyone 12:05 < quaid> congrats on another fine gold ISO to fall from the heavens 12:06 * jmbuser is still downloading the LiveCD 12:06 < stickster> Hear, hear 12:06 -!- JSchmitt [n=s4504kr@fedora/JSchmitt] has quit [Connection timed out] 12:07 < quaid> ok, then 12:07 < jmbuser> +1 12:07 -!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: FDSCo deciding stuff -- What is Docs focus? Can we handle a switch to focus on Fedora contributors first? What does this mean? Are people interested in this? Would they be upset if other active resources were to focus on contributors instead of end-user docs? 12:07 < quaid> ok, you may say ... wtf is this? 12:07 < jmbuser> ?? 12:08 < quaid> but folks around here have been talking about trying to resolve our own contributor problems before user problems 12:08 < quaid> that is, there is a world of help for users that is nearly good enough for all they need, and we are but a drop in that bucket, Fedora brand or not. 12:08 < jmbuser> true 12:08 < quaid> but the contributors are a finite group with a finite set of problems that we could really help give a better life. 12:08 < stickster> So this is something I feel strongly about. 12:09 < quaid> so, and I am repeating a suggestion from someone else, we could just decide to pull away anyone who is interested in talking this situation 12:09 < stickster> Let me take off my FPL hat... and put on a purely Docs guy hat. 12:09 < quaid> forget all the guides and all that for a while, etc. 12:09 < quaid> stickster: go ahead, please, as the suggestor :) 12:09 < stickster> I don't want to interrupt rudely, sorry 12:10 < stickster> But by the same token, I want to take the blame for this idea because it may be... controversial. 12:10 < stickster> I feel that we in Docs have been laboring a LONG, LOOONNNNG time to get some basic user documentation done. 12:10 < stickster> And that documentation already exists in so many places. 12:11 < stickster> The licensing on those other docs elsewhere keep us from just using them, so we are basically *FORCED* to do a "NIH" (not invented here) thing and redo everything from scratch ourselves. 12:11 < stickster> What we *really* need to do, if you ask me -- 12:11 * quaid askes 12:11 < stickster> is to concentrate on writing documentation that is going to help other people contribute to Fedora. 12:11 < quaid> aka fix our own leaky roof, shod our own children 12:12 < stickster> Right, and not just for Docs, but for other groups as well. 12:12 < stickster> You might think to yourself, that this sounds really like cleaning up the wiki and doing a good job tying things together there. 12:12 < stickster> And I'm saying -- well, yes. 12:13 < stickster> We have always been of two minds about the wiki 12:13 < stickster> But the truth is, with the single sign-on coming, the wiki will be easier than ever for new contributors. 12:13 < stickster> Get an account, start editing the wiki right away. 12:13 < stickster> And that's all well and good 12:13 < stickster> But the REAL audience for Fedora is the CONTRIBUTOR audience. 12:13 < jmbuser> +1 12:14 < stickster> We need to empower them to GET INVOLVED. 12:14 < stickster> To work on PACKAGING. 12:14 < stickster> On MARKETING. 12:14 < stickster> On WEBSITES/INFRASTRUCTURE. 12:14 < stickster> On DOCS. (!) 12:14 < stickster> Those are the people that keep Fedora alive. 12:14 -!- J5 [n=quintice(a)66.187.234.199] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:14 < stickster> The contributors are our audience. 12:15 < quaid> I meant he bigger roof, foshure! 12:15 < jsmith> +1 12:15 < stickster> We love users, and are overjoyed we have milliions of them. 12:15 < stickster> But users in and of themselves do not power FOSS just through using it -- contributors who give something back, do. 12:15 < stickster> That could be as little as filing one bug -- meaning any user can be a contributor. 12:15 < quaid> I think we'll find that after we do this, the wiki will work right and we can shepherd new contributors to work within some of the docs we've defined 12:16 < stickster> But only if he knows *how* to do it. 12:16 < stickster> quaid: I think it's going to help a lot. 12:16 < quaid> content == screencasts, written, translated 12:16 < quaid> my recommendation is ... 12:16 * couf here 12:16 < stickster> There's also another audience to think about -- not just the hobbyist, but the independent software vendors (ISVs), companies, and so on 12:16 < quaid> couf: catch up on that, eh? :) 12:16 < stickster> We need to help them get involved in Fedora too. 12:16 < quaid> right, this helps them. 12:16 < couf> quaid: busy :) 12:16 < kital> good 12:17 < quaid> ok, so, two ideas I propose: 12:17 < stickster> So what I'm recommending is that we ask ourselves for any piece of Documentation, "Is this something that's unique to Fedora?" 12:17 < stickster> If it's 90% not, then the document should be, well, 90% shorter. 12:17 < quaid> stickster: but we use that filter anyway ... 12:18 < quaid> and that is more stage 2 12:18 < quaid> where it is obvious that, how to work within Fedora, that is 90% Fedora specific 12:19 * quaid holds back proposals for more discussion ... 12:19 * couf does a +1 to the general suggestion 12:19 * stickster waits to see if he put everyone to sleep. 12:19 < jmbuser> stickster: I see the value in what you are saying 12:20 < jmbuser> Teach people to fish instead of making fish sandwiches 12:20 < couf> the one thing about this is, we can't know everything about everything in Fedora 12:21 < stickster> couf: Well, that goes for all Linux too. Thus my argument against writing big, general guides. 12:21 < couf> so that would mean tutoring, mentoring from people of thoose groups, and they've goot heaps of load too 12:21 < stickster> It very well may be that what I'm proposing comes down to the Docs team turning into a very specific, very targeted 12:21 < stickster> force for scouring the new wiki, and organizing it before we take on any tasks beyond the Release Notes and the Installation Guide. 12:21 < stickster> And both of *THOSE* could easily turn into online living things as well I suppose. 12:22 < quaid> I've been going around saying for the last few weeks that I want to be the new Wiki Gardener 12:22 < couf> right 12:22 < stickster> And if people want to do guides, maybe we should think about moving those off to fedorahosted.org to develop as independent projects 12:22 < quaid> with all that the metaphor implies 12:22 < stickster> And eliminating the Docs CVS. 12:22 * stickster waits for the explosion.... 12:22 < couf> wtf? :) 12:22 < quaid> and one idea is to have a regular set of gardening hours, maybe around our meeting time for example, where anyone interested helps prune, plant, and compost 12:22 * jmbuser loves the wiki 12:23 < stickster> jmbuser: You'll love it more when it's Mediawiki. 12:23 < quaid> we have to be honest 12:23 < quaid> outside of the relnotes 12:23 < quaid> the conversion is just not worth it 12:23 < quaid> or rather, it hasn't been worth it much 12:23 < quaid> Installation Guide the one exception 12:23 < quaid> usually requiring heroics 12:23 < quaid> (and it stays in XML :) 12:24 < Sparks> I'm confused. If we cater to the developers then we help built the project. That's good. If we alienate the users then we are developing a project only for ourselves. That's bad. 12:24 < stickster> I feel a sense of guilt that I pick the RelNotes and the IG as the two "important" docs when I have worked quite a bit on both. 12:24 < couf> yeah, for some stuff it feels like overkill 12:24 < quaid> with Transifex, we are freed of CVS 12:24 < stickster> But with or without me, users really rely on those. 12:24 < Sparks> I'm not sure how much help the developers need. 12:24 < stickster> The Relnotes more than the IG. 12:25 < stickster> Sparks: It's not the *established* developers, it's the *new* developers who need help. 12:25 < stickster> New package maintainers. 12:25 * jmbuser thanks stickster for his last-minute rescue effort on the IG 12:25 < stickster> New bug triagers... 12:25 < stickster> New platform users 12:25 < quaid> +1K 12:25 < Sparks> stickster: Okay. I'm good with that. But I think we should provide that documentation, too. 12:25 < stickster> Sparks: Dropping guides we can't ever finish != Alienating users 12:26 < Sparks> But what are we telling the n00bs that come to Fedora looking for help? 12:26 < stickster> After all, we have millions of users, and really good press apparently, without them. 12:26 < stickster> Sparks: That's exactly it -- our wiki should be a more robust, well-tended garden of docs. 12:26 < stickster> Sparks: We should be able to point them to wiki pages that tell them what they need, in easy terms. 12:26 < quaid> so let me ask the white elephant question 12:26 < quaid> how is l10n in MW? 12:27 < quaid> can we hook it to Tx somehow? 12:27 < couf> wow, that's the killer question 12:27 < jsmith> Ugh... 12:27 * jsmith falls over dead 12:27 < quaid> well, we dunno 12:27 < quaid> maybe we *can* version it in git and generate PO/POT 12:27 < jmbuser> MW = MediaWiki 12:27 < quaid> yes, sorry 12:27 < jmbuser> Tx = Transiflex 12:28 < mmcgrath> pong 12:28 < quaid> s/flex/fex/ 12:28 < stickster> quaid: This is a good question. I asked mmcgrath to pitch in his opinion on L10N in MW 12:28 < quaid> aye 12:28 * mmcgrath is here to give opinions. 12:28 < stickster> And speak of the... well, angel 12:28 -!- red_alert [n=ill@fedora/redalert] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:28 < stickster> Is there any possibility that people will be able to translate stuff in the wiki in some way? 12:28 < mmcgrath> So I think we should do it the same way mediawiki and suse does that. I'm not 100% sure on technical implementations but its basically this... 12:28 < mmcgrath> Every language gets its own wiki instance. 12:28 < jsmith> wiki != CMS 12:29 < stickster> +10 for reusing other working ideas. 12:29 < stickster> jsmith: True enough. 12:29 < mmcgrath> something (this I'm not sure of) sits in the middle and makes it so if you go to a page that hasn't been translated, you get the english version. 12:29 < mmcgrath> I'm not sure how it all works. 12:29 < quaid> oh, well 12:29 < stickster> Where "working" != "hacked together tearfully" 12:29 < quaid> that's different in a sense 12:29 < quaid> that is how it is presented to the world 12:29 < quaid> but how do they translate? 12:29 < stickster> Right, how does the engine work. 12:29 < mmcgrath> but there are working examples somewhere. And I've had the lines of communcation opened to the suse guys before, I'll just go ask them. 12:29 < quaid> do they open the page and write in new content? ugh 12:30 < stickster> This is something we may have to have someone research. 12:30 < mmcgrath> quaid: ahhh, the actual translation? I have no idea. 12:30 < stickster> That doesn't need to be mmcgrath. 12:30 < quaid> also 12:30 < quaid> for the engine part 12:30 < stickster> It's certainly a good question. 12:30 < quaid> we could conceive of replacing it or hooking it to Tx 12:30 < couf> yeah, I'm afraid it's as current wiki-translation is going 12:30 < quaid> couf: explain please? 12:30 < couf> look at a page, copy it, translate it, ... 12:31 < couf> same as for Moin 12:31 < mmcgrath> 12:31 < mmcgrath> 12:31 * jmbuser sees mmcgrath is speechless 12:31 < mmcgrath> <nod> its my understanding thats how it works. 12:31 < couf> if not, wikipedia translations would be way more complete in a sense 12:31 < stickster> http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSUSE_Translation_Guide 12:31 < mmcgrath> I'm not really taking sides in the whole wiki vs cms thing for translations just because I'm conflicted enough about it. 12:32 < stickster> Yup. 12:32 < quaid> look, in the end 12:32 < quaid> wiki content is strings with markup 12:32 < mmcgrath> I mean, if people want to do it, I guess I say let them. I'm not sure how they decide what gets translated. 12:32 < quaid> what we need 12:32 < quaid> is someone to commit to writing a parser 12:32 < quaid> MW wiki => PO/POT 12:32 < quaid> if it doesn't exist, it should 12:33 < quaid> and then imagine exposing MW via Transifex ... useful,w hat? 12:33 < stickster> http://translate.sourceforge.net/wiki/toolkit/txt2po 12:33 < mmcgrath> po/pot with mediawiki I'd think would be possible but I don't know if it exists. 12:33 < stickster> ^^^ 12:33 < mmcgrath> at least not in a way that mediawiki can then read in and present to the user. 12:33 < stickster> Note mediawiki is a supported flavor 12:33 < mmcgrath> something to look at then. 12:34 < stickster> And pootle -- that source project -- is a vigorously supported and thriving project, not old & busted. 12:34 < mmcgrath> stickster: it looks like that only supports mw markup -> po. I don't think that mediawiki can then read that po back in and present it to the user. 12:34 < mmcgrath> I could be wrong though 12:34 < couf> po2txt :) 12:35 < stickster> They have both ways, I think 12:35 < couf> if that can get automated, that seems doable 12:35 < stickster> couf: +1 txt2po, po2txt 12:35 < quaid> wow, it looks like the instructions are, "translate the page" with no tools, so it means manually pulling strings into another tool 12:35 -!- J5 [n=quintice(a)66.187.234.199] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 12:36 -!- J5_ [n=quintice@nat/redhat-us/x-1a5779b8020dfed9] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:36 -!- viking-ice_ [n=johannbg(a)tgad78.rhi.hi.is] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 12:36 < stickster> quaid: You're talking about the OpenSuSE page> 12:36 < stickster> ? 12:36 < quaid> yes, sorry 12:36 < stickster> right. 12:36 < quaid> but in essence, that is what people do for the big wikipedia, right? 12:36 < stickster> See above. There is an automated tool for txt2po and po2txt. 12:36 < quaid> I see that now 12:36 < stickster> It handles mediawiki! :-) 12:36 < stickster> (supposedly) 12:36 < quaid> but is anyone using it with a WebUI for MW? 12:36 < stickster> So... worth trying. 12:36 < quaid> ok 12:36 < couf> mmcgrath: is there a way to xml-rpc data out of MW and back in? 12:36 < mmcgrath> but I don't see how mediawiki will handle it is all. 12:37 < quaid> we need to look at that on the side 12:37 < couf> or something like xml-rpc 12:37 < stickster> I would think that Transifex could do this. 12:37 < mmcgrath> couf: yeah, the api is pretty rich. I've even heard of fuse implementations to actualy mount mediawiki though I've not played with it. 12:37 < quaid> mmcgrath: something needs to inject the strings back in the MW files/database tables, and do it by language 12:37 < mmcgrath> well, transifex's implementation is "check out, alter, commit" 12:37 < mmcgrath> it does that with existing tools. 12:37 < mmcgrath> we might have to write our own tool for transifex to do it right. 12:37 < stickster> mmcgrath: Right, but I think it's built modularly enough that back end support for something else could be plugged in. 12:37 < quaid> we would likely want to put the files in SCM 12:37 < stickster> mmcgrath: yup 12:37 < couf> in other words: tools are pretty much in place, we just have to tie'em together 12:37 < stickster> mmcgrath: we're in violent agreement :-) 12:38 < quaid> or could, that is, so we can version them 12:38 < quaid> ok then 12:38 < stickster> quaid: Actually, MW versions. 12:38 < mmcgrath> possibly... I'm still not convinced mediawiki can read po files though. 12:38 < quaid> mmcgrath: let's try a bit of quid pro quo 12:38 < stickster> So we don't necessarily need an additional SCM. 12:38 < mmcgrath> since mediawiki gets all of its information from a database. 12:38 < mmcgrath> "quaid pro quo" 12:38 < quaid> mmcgrath: will you work with us 12:38 < jmbuser> This could be another great Fedora contrib to upstream 12:38 < stickster> mmcgrath: Right, it might take something external to do the conversion and inject the page change into MW. 12:38 < quaid> mmcgrath: to make a new project to get this to happen, owned by Infra 12:39 < quaid> mmcgrath: it is our condition on being able to move a bunch of work to the wiki *and* be the gardeners to keep it a tame and wonderful place 12:39 -!- runa_b [n=runa(a)59.160.127.177] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:39 < mmcgrath> quaid: I can help but not for a while, I've got a month of work to catch up on (because of the change freeze + release). I'm pretty well booked until the end of June is all. 12:39 < quaid> otherwise we are forever pushing guides out from there and into XML just so we can translate the things 12:39 -!- paragn_ [n=paragn(a)59.160.127.177] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:39 < quaid> not sure on timeframe 12:39 < mmcgrath> after that though I'll be happy to help. If you can find someone else in infrastructure that can do it sooner I'll make sure they have the access they need 12:39 -!- Southern_Gentlem [n=notfred@unaffiliated/southerngentlem/x-2894754] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:39 < stickster> We ought to see if we can put out a call for volunteer help in the Fedora community to kick this off. 12:40 * quaid has to be honest, DocBook is more for translation ease than for anything that a wiki cannot do "good enough" and be better at getting contributions 12:40 < stickster> I love DocBook too which is why I think any project we want to have in DocBook should just become a thriving entity in fedorahosted.org. 12:40 < quaid> mmcgrath: OK, general support for the idea of kicking off a potential upstream tool to plugin to the wiki is probably the most important, v. actual labor 12:40 < couf> I'll try and get some L1ON-input on this 12:41 < quaid> stickster: +1 to that! 12:41 < stickster> Especially since we can have a toolchain using an in-distro tool, Publican, to do the work. 12:41 < quaid> couf: that would be good; it's too late for a GSoC project :( 12:41 * jmbuser thought the same thing 12:41 < couf> yeah, that's a bummer 12:41 < stickster> At worst this might make for a BRILLIANT FUDCon hackfest topic. 12:41 < quaid> let's reorg this thing! 12:42 < jmbuser> Yes! 12:42 < quaid> so, can I lay out some decision points to make it clear we are agreed or not? 12:42 < jmbuser> Proceed 12:42 -!- mether_ [n=ask(a)59.160.127.177] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:43 < quaid> i. FDSCo agrees to turn attention on enabling *all* Fedora contributors? This is not done as a mandate/order but a statement of intent for the project. People can and should continue on whatever content is of interest to them and only pitch in where they want. 12:43 * quaid continues 12:43 < mmcgrath> :) 12:44 * couf feels a new wave coming :) 12:44 < quaid> ii. Work on managing the wiki as "gardeners" with one person designated to make the project happen (the Wiki Gardener), and make that a tame and happy place for all, however that has to happen. This includes resolving MediaWiki to work with Transifex and whatever. 12:45 < stickster> As for (i.), 100% agreed... but we need to make this a clear point on the ML, so volunteer contributors don't wonder why old guys aren't chomping at the bit to work on "new" guides over the next N months. 12:45 < quaid> iii. Push all DocBook XML guides out to be stand-alone projects on fedorahosted.org to use whatever toolchain they want; we can continue the docs-common tools (within fh.o?) and decide to swap in or make publican optional. 12:45 -!- GeroldKa [n=GeroldKa@fedora/geroldka] has quit ["Verlassend"] 12:45 < jsmith> stickster: +1 12:45 < stickster> oops, I interrupted, sorry :-\ 12:45 < quaid> iii.b Decide the best fate for the release notes in a separate discussion; cf. docs-common as well 12:45 < stickster> agreed 12:45 < quaid> um, I think that's it 12:45 < quaid> did I miss anything? 12:46 < quaid> (in summary, that is) 12:46 < couf> I don't think so, all good 12:46 < quaid> then we can do a quick bit of "last discussion" and voite 12:46 < quaid> so, to proceed 12:46 < jmbuser> s/voite/vote 12:46 < stickster> with respect to my previous point... I was trying to say... 12:46 < quaid> stickster made a bit of discussion there, +1 to making it clear on mailing list and all over 12:47 < stickster> a message to say "Here's what we're doing, here's why we're doing it" beyond the meeting minutes, etc. 12:47 < quaid> jmbuser: perogativeo f the leader today to just let typos fly :D 12:47 < stickster> But 'nuff said 12:47 < quaid> stickster: +1, also blogs, and direct chats 12:47 < stickster> disco 12:47 * glezos discussed Tx with the MW guys at FOSDEM 12:47 < quaid> it's also part of the "we're about to fuck with your wiki, heads up!" campaign 12:47 < quaid> glezos: ooh?! 12:47 < stickster> glezos: Cool, hope you saw my pitches up above ;-) 12:48 < jmbuser> One refinement - a landscaping crew with a chief, instead of a wiki gardener 12:48 < glezos> there is a sketchy mechanism for PO extraction, but only for the UI. AFAIK, the content can't be exported into POs. I might have missed something though. 12:48 < stickster> Now that we know OpenSuSE would also benefit from this, there's some cross-distro goodness for you 12:48 < stickster> I'm thinking, maybe I should email Zonker to find out if they have any ideas and/or resources to contribute. 12:48 < jmbuser> hack the wiki, hack the wiki 12:48 < couf> stickster: +1 12:48 < quaid> jmbuser: explain your distinction? 12:49 -!- fcrippa [n=fcrippa(a)host57-49-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:49 < quaid> jmbuser: in wiki gardener v. wiki landscaper 12:49 < stickster> glezos: Are you talking about a bulit-in MW capability? 12:49 < jmbuser> quaid: wiki gardener sounds like a lonely job 12:49 -!- GeroldKa [n=GeroldKa@fedora/geroldka] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:49 < jmbuser> chief garderner with apprentices is better 12:50 < glezos> stickster: yes. Not sure if a proper PO-extraction layer exists for content. 12:50 * Sparks volunteers to be the guy on those cool stand-up lawn mowers 12:50 < stickster> glezos: Have you seen pootle's tools? 12:50 < stickster> http://translate.sourceforge.net/wiki/toolkit/txt2po 12:50 -!- stickster is now known as stickster_afk 12:50 -!- stickster_afk is now known as stickster 12:50 < quaid> jmbuser: in my mind, it is mental preparation for being the one who gets all the hot compost landing on them when the other subprojects let fly 12:50 < glezos> stickster: yes. I was talking about Mediawiki in particular. Not just a converter, but a built-in capability in MW to extract and manage PO files. 12:51 < jmbuser> stickster has left the building 12:51 < glezos> BTW -- I would *love* to work on something like this at some point in the future. 12:51 < jmbuser> ...or not 12:51 * glezos still reading the log 12:52 < stickster> Aw crap. 12:52 * stickster remembers Ctrl+R means something very specific in xchat-gnome. 12:52 < glezos> mmcgrath: with the GSoC, I'll be working on abstraction layers in Tx to make it able to receive and submit content from various tools (eg. submit via https or even plain email instead of ssh) 12:52 -!- ldimagg_ [n=ldimaggi@nat/redhat-us/x-a4ef544f65d68dd2] has quit ["Leaving"] 12:52 < mmcgrath> glezos: excellent. 12:52 < stickster> glezos: Right -- would it work for Tx to check out POT by using something like pootle's txt2po against a MW revision, then doing po2txt and pushing it back into MW? 12:53 < stickster> err.. well, you get my drift. 12:53 < jmbuser> undoubtedly :-) 12:53 < glezos> stickster: The challenge would be to implement a PO manager inside MW. After that, Tx can take those PO files quite easily. 12:53 < stickster> glezos: never mind, you just answered my previous question. 12:54 -!- sdziallas [n=sebastia(a)p57A2EB5F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:54 < quaid> ok, we are adrift 12:54 < quaid> to the points above, a quick show of hands: 12:54 * stickster gets out of the way of the rudder. 12:54 < Sparks> +1 12:54 < quaid> i. FDSCo agrees to change the order of things thusly ... 12:55 < stickster> +1 to i, ii, and iii. 12:55 < couf> +1 12:55 < jmbuser> +1 to all - change is good 12:55 < quaid> whee! 12:55 < quaid> +1 from me 12:55 -!- Irssi: #fedora-meeting: Total of 107 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 106 normal] 12:55 < couf> and thats ratified :) 12:55 < stickster> So unanimously we've pretty much changed the nature of the Docs Project for the future. 12:55 < quaid> but wait, there's more! 12:55 < stickster> Pretty good for an hour's work 12:55 < quaid> glezos, jsmith 12:56 < glezos> +1 12:56 < stickster> You can cut a tin can with them! 12:56 < jmbuser> genzu knives? 12:56 < jsmith> +1 12:56 < quaid> then that is unanimous unless I'm stupidly forgetting someone 12:56 < couf> quaid: bob 12:56 -!- mether_ [n=ask(a)59.160.127.177] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 12:56 < quaid> EvilBob is not here but here? 12:57 < jmbuser> EvilBob: ping 12:57 < couf> well Sparks jumped in his place, so .. :) 12:57 < quaid> Sparks: I saw you comment a bit earlier ... 12:57 < quaid> heh 12:57 -!- JSchmitt [n=s4504kr(a)p4FDD176F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #fedora-meeting 12:57 < quaid> ok, yes, I see :) 12:57 < quaid> just making sure we adequately 12:57 < quaid> addressed the idea of continuing content work 12:58 < quaid> (e.g. Sec Guide :) 12:58 < quaid> ok, rock on 12:58 < quaid> two minutes 12:58 < quaid> elections? 12:58 * quaid looks at the pages 12:58 -!- quaid changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: FDSCo - two minutes for election discussion 12:58 * stickster makes motion to push this until next week 12:58 < quaid> that's what it seems to be like 12:58 * stickster selfish because he's about to get on the phone :-\ 12:58 * stickster backs away 12:59 < quaid> and the channel has a turnover 12:59 < jsmith> I second the motion 12:59 < quaid> ok, let's push this topic to the next meeting 12:59 < couf> yep, push back 12:59 < jmbuser> +1 12:59 < quaid> and catch up on #fedora-docs to refresh ourselves on the elections :) 12:59 < quaid> and be out of here in 5 12:59 < quaid> 4 12:59 < quaid> 3 12:59 < quaid> 2 12:59 < quaid> 1 12:59 < quaid> </meeting>

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FDSCo Meeting 2008-05-14 Summary
by Karsten Wade 14 May '08

14 May '08

Attendees: ----------- John Babich Eric Christensen Jared Smith Dimitris Glezos PaulFrields Bart Couvreur Summary: --------- We discussed one main item and pushed all others to the next meeting. The topic was: temporary and potentially permanent focus and process changes to how we do documentation. What we focus on and how we do it. The following points were unanimously passed by FDSCo; some subsequent discussion points were folded into these final set of points. i. FDSCo agrees to turn the attention of this project to content that helps Fedora contributors. This is not done as a mandate/order but a statement of intent for the project. People can and should continue on whatever content is of interest to them and only pitch in where they want. ii. Work on managing the wiki as "gardeners" with one person designated to make the project happen (the Chief Wiki Gardener) and many hands welcome (Wiki Garden Apprentices and Garden Gnomes). Their job is to make the wiki a tame and happy place for all, however that has to happen. This includes resolving MediaWiki to work with Transifex and whatever. iii. Push all DocBook XML guides out to be stand-alone projects on fedorahosted.org to use whatever toolchain they want; we can continue the docs-common tools (within fh.o?) and decide to swap in or make publican optional. iii.b Decide the best fate for the release notes in a separate discussion; cf. docs-common as well

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Release Notes update 2
by Paul W. Frields 13 May '08

13 May '08

I pushed out fedora-release-notes-9.0.1-1 this morning. That's what's going into the update pile for F9. 1. We need to get the new content pushed to the web site and retagged LIVE. 2. On Friday or Saturday, we should resync the content from the wiki to XML, and let L10N know about it with, say, a Tuesday deadline (should be very small changse). 3. On Wednesday, we should pick up the changes, and push the publication to the web site. 4. At about the same time, we should get a new fedora-release-notes-9.0.2-1 package together. -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ irc.freenode.net: stickster @ #fedora-docs, #fedora-devel, #fredlug

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