docs November 2009

docs@lists.stg.fedoraproject.org

34 participants
79 discussions

fedora documentation bugs work flow
by A. Mani 22 Nov '09

22 Nov '09

Where is the guide for this? It does not seem to be on the wiki It is obviously different from that indicated for fedora bugzilla in the wiki Thanks A. Mani -- A. Mani ASL, CLC, AMS, CMS http://www.logicamani.co.cc

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Docs Project History
by Eric Christensen 21 Nov '09

21 Nov '09

It would be great if everyone could take a look at the Docs Project History[1] wiki page and populate where you can. If you worked on any projects throughout the years you should add your name where appropriate. [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/History_of_the_Docs_Project --Eric

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Instruction on how to attribute Fedora information in other guides
by Eric Christensen 21 Nov '09

21 Nov '09

Earlier this week I was editing our licensing FAQ[1] on the wiki (was still showing OPL instead of CC-BY-SA) and both Spot and Richard made some edits to clarify some points. One thing we need to publish is instructions for others who want to site Fedora documentation in their works. Anyone have any ideas? [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_licensing_FAQ --Eric

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Documentation hosted at Fedora Hosted
by Eric Christensen 21 Nov '09

21 Nov '09

If you have a project that is hosted at Fedora Hosted please add it to the list on the wiki[1]. [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Documentation_hosted_at_Fedora_Hosted Thank you! --Eric

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PK Fix isn't working
by Eric Christensen 19 Nov '09

19 Nov '09

I just tried the fix (should have done this hours ago) and it doesn't work. My recommendation is to take the fix out of the Release Notes and the Security Guide and say that more information is forthcoming. Thoughts? --Eric

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Docs Project Leader elections
by Eric Christensen 19 Nov '09

19 Nov '09

I've started a wiki page[1] to start the process of collecting nominations for the Docs Project Leader. I'd like to hold elections at next week's meeting. If you have a nomination please list it on the wiki! Thanks! [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_Leader_Elections --Eric

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Docs Meeting 2009-11-18 Summary
by Eric Christensen 18 Nov '09

18 Nov '09

=================================================================================================== #fedora-meeting: Docs Project Meeting - Agenda: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings =================================================================================================== Meeting started by Sparks at 00:02:20 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2009-11-19/fedora-meeting.2… . Meeting summary --------------- * Roll Call (Sparks, 00:02:29) * Docs Project Leader Elections (Sparks, 00:08:50) * ACTION: Sparks to send out email on nominations (Sparks, 00:15:35) * Release Notes (Sparks, 00:16:19) * LINK: http://fedora.is-sixsigma.com/F12beta/ - regenerated every night, from t12zeroday even tho it says beta (jjmcd, 00:29:46) * Guide Status (Sparks, 00:49:38) * New Guides (Sparks, 00:52:28) * Status on CC license rollout. (Sparks, 00:53:03) * All other business (Sparks, 00:54:14) * LINK: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=534047 ? :) (radsy, 00:55:10) Meeting ended at 01:01:19 UTC. Action Items ------------ * Sparks to send out email on nominations Action Items, by person ----------------------- * Sparks * Sparks to send out email on nominations * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * Sparks (76) * jjmcd (70) * rudi (44) * radsy (13) * zodbot (3) * bcotton (2) * buggbot (1) Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4 .. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot

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Docs Meeting 2009-11-18 IRC log
by Eric Christensen 18 Nov '09

18 Nov '09

00:02:20 <Sparks> #startmeeting Docs Project Meeting - Agenda: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings 00:02:20 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Nov 19 00:02:20 2009 UTC. The chair is Sparks. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 00:02:20 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 00:02:29 <Sparks> #topic Roll Call 00:02:30 * Sparks 00:02:32 * radsy is here 00:02:35 * rudi is here 00:02:38 * bcotton is here 00:02:48 * jjmcd . 00:04:41 * Sparks gives everyone a few more minutes 00:08:21 <Sparks> Okay, let's get started 00:08:41 <Sparks> #chair jjmcd 00:08:41 <zodbot> Current chairs: Sparks jjmcd 00:08:50 <Sparks> #topic Docs Project Leader Elections 00:09:18 <Sparks> When I took this job back in January(?) I wanted to make sure that we had elections for a new leader after F12 got released. 00:09:26 <Sparks> So here is my suggestion... 00:09:47 <Sparks> We take nominations starting tonight and vote next week. 00:09:51 <Sparks> Thoughts? 00:09:59 <jjmcd> wikipage 00:10:22 <Sparks> That's a good place to start 00:10:41 <rudi> sounds like a plan; and the wiki is the natural place for noms to go 00:10:55 <jjmcd> Although, we could just agree to re-elect you by acclimation 00:10:55 <Sparks> rudi: Works for me. 00:11:12 <Sparks> I won't take the job unless someone else runs 00:11:13 <Sparks> :) 00:11:25 * Sparks votes for ---> that guy 00:11:41 <jjmcd> And I won't run unless I can find a sucker ... errr ... leader for RNs 00:12:04 <Sparks> We should probably figure out if we want to do this yearly or releasely or... 00:12:32 <jjmcd> Personally, I could argue for either 00:12:47 <jjmcd> Yearly gives somebody a chance to get established 00:12:51 <Sparks> yes 00:13:04 <jjmcd> releasely gives is a quicker way to get rid of a turkey 00:14:00 <bcotton> i'd think releasely would be a bit hectic 00:14:10 <Sparks> jjmcd: I think you should be able to get rid of me... err... a turkey at any point 00:14:20 * Sparks establishes https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_Leader_Elections 00:14:28 <jjmcd> So we need an impeachment process? 00:14:45 <Sparks> WE DON'T LIKE YOU ANYMORE... GET OFF THE STAGE! 00:15:14 * jjmcd prefers burning torches 00:15:22 <Sparks> Okay, I'll send out an email after the meeting 00:15:35 <Sparks> #action Sparks to send out email on nominations 00:15:52 <Sparks> Okay, anything else on this topic? 00:16:19 <Sparks> #topic Release Notes 00:16:39 <jjmcd> You saw the notes to the list 00:16:42 <Sparks> First I'd like to thank jjmcd and rudi and everyone else who helped in getting the Release Notes completed. 00:17:10 <Sparks> You guys did an awesome job! 00:17:18 <Sparks> Now if our technology could keep up... :) 00:17:25 <Sparks> jjmcd: What are the translation issues? 00:17:27 <rudi> Ta -- there are still some bugs in the process, but we're getting better :) 00:17:27 <jjmcd> They do look nice on the new F12 background - but that's all on mo 00:17:46 <jjmcd> rudi is tracking them down, I think most are explainable 00:18:00 <jjmcd> We do need to decide when to publish 00:18:20 <jjmcd> and I like rudi's idea of moving in a direction of translators publishing, or at least deciding when 00:18:43 <jjmcd> And OBTW, as translations are committed, the built docs ARE available 00:18:53 <Sparks> jjmcd: I'd like it if the translators would join us on these meetings... especially around release time 00:19:01 <jjmcd> But without building themselves, translators have no view into the errors 00:19:20 <jjmcd> Yes, noriko at least was joining us for a while 00:19:25 <Sparks> jjmcd: So we need to do a classroom on how to use Publican? 00:19:32 <jjmcd> but they are spread out across timezones 00:19:37 <rudi> Sparks -- no, the problem is more deep-seated 00:19:42 <jjmcd> Well, it is a major PITA until the new TFX 00:19:56 <Sparks> jjmcd: True. Maybe the lead translator for each lang could join us... TZs make it tough 00:20:02 <rudi> yeah; Tx 0.7 is the blocker 00:20:12 <Sparks> rudi: more deep-seated? 00:20:26 <rudi> Until then, translators not only need to know how to use publican, but how to wrangle the merging and splitting as well 00:20:45 <jjmcd> And that isn't always obvious 00:20:47 <Sparks> yes 00:20:55 <rudi> and the "how to use Publican" is the least of their worries. 00:21:00 <Sparks> it isn't obvious to me! 00:21:11 <rudi> Even after all this time, *we* still bungle the merging and splitting 00:21:13 <jjmcd> When everything is hunky-dory, we could script it. But things are rarely perfect 00:21:34 <rudi> (which is the root of most of the English strings we're still seeing cropping up in the translations) 00:21:45 <jjmcd> Yep, that was my suspicion 00:22:05 <rudi> jjmcd -- yeah, confirmed. With yours truly being the chief bungler :) 00:22:43 <jjmcd> I will remind docs and trans later where to find the nightly builds of f12zeroday-tx 00:23:11 <rudi> But there are also some genuinely inexplicable ones, where strings we can see are definitely translated somehow don't get carried across the split... 00:23:11 <Sparks> jjmcd: When will the next batch ready to commit? 00:23:39 <rudi> Sparks, jjmcd -- we need to make a decision about when and whether to refresh the POTs 00:23:49 <jjmcd> rudi: yep. Sparks: Schedule says tomorrow, but I am poking L10N to ask if that makes sense 00:23:49 <rudi> And we probably need some input from L10N on that 00:24:11 <jjmcd> And with the latest flamebug, we may want to do that again real soon now 00:24:32 <Sparks> ya 00:24:39 <rudi> The refresh would pull in the latest fixes (from f12-temp), plus the flamebug, plus assorted small glitches that are breaking translations 00:25:14 <rudi> jjmcd -- did you want to do this before or after packaging the RN? 00:25:24 <jjmcd> I would also like to get something authoratative on processors. We have an outstanding bug that disagrees with other experts, and I don't know who to believe 00:25:45 <jjmcd> rudi, we have a package in the DVD, and a more recent package on updates 00:26:09 <jjmcd> We will want to do another probably for the install thing first en then maybe all langs 00:26:16 <rudi> jjmcd -- Ah OK! so any update is not going to interfere with thath 00:26:23 <rudi> * that 00:26:25 <jjmcd> I don't think we want to wait that one for the translations 00:26:42 <jjmcd> yeah, Sparks has been great on getting these things to the repos 00:26:45 <rudi> OK -- so regenerate today? 00:26:56 <jjmcd> sounds good to me 00:27:25 <jjmcd> There is more manual than I would like in the packaging, but it isn't some huge deal 00:28:08 <jjmcd> The real problem is waiting hours and hours to build all the langs 00:28:16 <jjmcd> Well, mostly to merge 00:28:28 <jjmcd> BTW, I saw you committed some merged pos 00:28:44 <jjmcd> If we can keep up with that, it could be a real help 00:29:16 <rudi> NP -- I'm trying to make sure that the master branch stays current and ready to build 00:29:24 <jjmcd> good, I like that 00:29:46 <jjmcd> http://fedora.is-sixsigma.com/F12beta/ - regenerated every night, from t12zeroday even tho it says beta 00:29:58 <rudi> So -- the other question is -- do we wait till we have an answer on the arches before rebuilding? 00:30:05 <rudi> *regenerating 00:30:30 <jjmcd> I think we need to deal with the install policy immediately 00:31:15 <rudi> We have text on the policy change ready to insert? 00:31:19 <jjmcd> As much as I would like an answer on the other, I think all those guys are burning their cycles on BZ534047 00:31:24 <jjmcd> No 00:31:28 <jjmcd> Well, there is text 00:31:35 <jjmcd> and widespread agreement it is wron 00:32:09 <rudi> OK -- well, we need something definitive in the f12-temp branch ASAP 00:32:19 <rudi> radsy -- are you in a position to write it up? 00:32:24 <jjmcd> So, I will craft some weasel words that try to avoid the emotion, but we still need a definitive workaround 00:32:43 <rudi> Yeah -- whether the change is good, bad, or ugly is not relevant to the RN 00:32:58 <jjmcd> The fix posted by Seth isn't even available to most people 00:33:03 <rudi> Just its effects and what to do if you don't like it for whatever reason 00:33:20 <jjmcd> You gotta be a policykit developer to even have the tool 00:33:27 <jjmcd> It is the what to do that is the problem 00:34:03 <jjmcd> Not too hard to describe the change 00:34:44 <rudi> OK 00:34:51 <jjmcd> Does that become 5.2.1, or 4.1? 00:34:55 <rudi> So where are we going to get that from? 00:35:16 <jjmcd> Well, the bug thread hasn't slowed yet 00:35:41 <rudi> I'd say 5.2.1, with a pointer in 4.1 00:35:59 <jjmcd> Oh maybe it has. I couldn't get a word in edgewise earlier, but now it's been an hour since someone commented 00:36:19 <jjmcd> On the bug, I'm sure the mailing list is still lively 00:36:39 <Sparks> jjmcd: Would now be a good time to ask for a definitive answer on what needs to go in the RNs? 00:36:48 <jjmcd> Or everyone got frustrated with the in-flight collisions on bugzilla 00:37:00 <jjmcd> Ask where? 00:37:13 <Sparks> jjmcd: The more I think about it the more I think that PK should just be uninstalled on systems where users shouldn't be installing software... almost makes sense. 00:37:16 <Sparks> jjmcd: On the bug. 00:37:24 <jjmcd> Seems like everyone has a horse in this race 00:37:25 <Sparks> jjmcd: you/we still need an answer 00:37:30 <jjmcd> yep 00:37:44 * Sparks got hit twice on the same post with a collision 00:37:52 <jjmcd> And we need to test it 00:38:09 <jjmcd> Much of what has been talked about doesn't work for ordinary mortals 00:38:49 <Sparks> jjmcd: I agree 00:39:10 <jjmcd> What I think we are saying, rudi, is that we aren't ready for a full rebuild 00:39:30 <Sparks> jjmcd: Well... work up some text saying what PK does and that a solution is in the works 00:39:31 <jjmcd> I'll post en-US as soon as we get an answer, and we can do the big thing tomorrow 00:39:38 <rudi> yeah, that's what I'm hearing. 00:39:44 <Sparks> jjmcd: If you get the solution before you crash for the night then put it in... 00:39:53 <Sparks> jjmcd: otherwise build it and let's do a push 00:40:02 <Sparks> ok 00:40:02 <jjmcd> Yeah, at least on docs.fp.o I can put a warning 00:40:10 <Sparks> WORKSFORME 00:42:26 <Sparks> Okay, anything else on the Release Notes? 00:42:42 <jjmcd> rudi, any clue why the rev history is missing from the trans? 00:43:11 <rudi> jjmcd -- yeah; I turned them off 00:43:16 <jjmcd> Oh, OK 00:43:18 <rudi> when I was building 00:43:38 <rudi> the changes that you had to make for yelp caused them to blow up when I was building the translated versions 00:43:47 <jjmcd> I had no theory about that, as long as there's an answer and it isn't a mystery 00:43:57 <rudi> And, strapped for time, that seemed like the best solution 00:44:06 <jjmcd> oooohhhh, I thought I kept the yelp changes out of git except for the table length 00:44:10 <rudi> Yeah; no mystery 00:44:38 <rudi> Hmmm. 00:45:01 <rudi> So the "xyz changes (cont'd)" shouldn't be in there either? 00:45:09 <jjmcd> I cut the max table size down some in the hopes it might help - didn't 00:45:20 <jjmcd> Oh yeah, just the tables were shorter 00:45:24 <rudi> Oh OK 00:45:36 <jjmcd> I think I was limiting them to like 250 entries or something, shortened to 100 00:46:05 <jjmcd> didn't help,.. but I also hoped they might help you build, too 00:46:20 <rudi> Well, *something* helped me build 00:46:40 <rudi> I was finally able to build them on my machine without having to SSH into ryanlerch's :) 00:46:42 <jjmcd> Don't you love a good mystery 00:49:29 <Sparks> Okay... Moving on... 00:49:38 <Sparks> #topic Guide Status 00:49:53 <Sparks> Anyone have any problems with their guide or want to talk about their guide? 00:50:37 <radsy> i did lots of updates to the selinux user-guide yesterday, thanks to a BZ that slipped through the cracks of my memory 00:50:46 <radsy> got it up in CVS overnight, it's fine now 00:50:55 <Sparks> radsy: Cool! 00:51:01 <Sparks> Anyone else? 00:51:10 <radsy> basically the removal of setroubleshootd as a permanent daemon 00:52:18 <Sparks> :) 00:52:28 <Sparks> #topic New Guides 00:52:33 <Sparks> Any new guides in the works? 00:53:03 <Sparks> #topic Status on CC license rollout. 00:53:11 <Sparks> For those of you that didn't know... 00:53:28 <Sparks> We have officially changed over to the CC-BY-SA license! 00:53:34 <Sparks> All of these tasks are complete! 00:53:56 <Sparks> Thanks to everyone who made this possible... it was truly a team effort. 00:54:14 <Sparks> #topic All other business 00:54:28 <Sparks> And with six minutes left... does anyone have anything else they'd like to discuss? 00:55:10 <radsy> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=534047 ? :) 00:55:11 <buggbot> Bug 534047: high, low, ---, richard, ASSIGNED, All users get to install software on a machine they do not have the root password to 00:55:41 <radsy> i'm starting to think we might want to wait for the dust to settle 00:56:04 <radsy> security response team are trying to find out if it will be reverted 00:56:21 <radsy> nobody knows it seems... 00:56:35 <Sparks> radsy: IMHO we need to get the word out that right now the vulnerability exists. 00:56:53 <radsy> your call 00:57:02 <Sparks> if admins/owners don't know that there is a change then they are assuming that they are protected. 00:57:20 <Sparks> but, of course, that is my opinion... 00:57:31 <radsy> we do have a lot of hits on the RN right now, being so close after release 00:57:54 <Sparks> Yeah 00:58:17 <radsy> i guess it can't hurt, quick enough to pull if needed 00:58:27 <Sparks> anyone have any thoughts on how Docs should handle the PK ordeal within the next 24-hours? 00:58:42 <Sparks> I'm assuming that within 72-hours we'll know more and can stand down more. 00:58:55 <Sparks> radsy: ya... we can get text up and down very quickly 00:58:56 <rudi> Well, we could add a note about the *existence* of the issue right now 00:59:08 <Sparks> rudi: Yeah, that's basically what I'm thinking right now 00:59:13 <rudi> Even if we don't have a suggested fix 00:59:35 <rudi> I kinda think that if there were a fix out there that most people could implement, we would have heard about it by now... 00:59:42 <radsy> and mention it's still in contention 00:59:50 <rudi> radsy +1 01:00:05 <Sparks> yep 01:00:33 <Sparks> Okay... it is the end of our hour. Anything else to discuss before we close? 01:00:55 <radsy> nice timing :) 01:01:16 <Sparks> Thanks everyone for coming tonight! 01:01:19 <Sparks> #endmeeting

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More details on Issues with Release Notes translations
by John J. McDonough 18 Nov '09

18 Nov '09

Going through all the languages on docs.fp.o I find some interesting things. pt-BR is marked draft and is, in fact, older than the others. It is missing the sections that are not translated in the other languages. I think the discoonect here is that on the first push to docs.fp.o, I pushed all languages that were at greater than 90%. Since then we have only pushed 100%. pt-BR is still only at 92%. We probably should bring up on the trans list whether we want to wait for 100%. The French team in particular objected to pushing partly translated documents. I suspect some of the others may want to see mostly translated documents published. In all the other languages, 4.1.6, 5.2.2, 5.6.1, and 5.7.1 are not translated All are missing the revision history Titles for 7.5 and 8.9 are untranslated Title for 4.4 is untranslated in all except Chinese and Russian Title for 4.1 is untranslated in Dutch On the copies I ran last night (http://fedora.is-sixsigma.com/F12beta/) I only checked Dutch, Portuguese, Polish and Spanish. On those, all of the sections untranslated on docs.fp.o were translated. In Dutch, Portuguese and Polish, the title for 8.9 was translated. OK, so now I know less than I did before! --McD

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Fedora Docs Meeting Reminder
by Eric Christensen 18 Nov '09

18 Nov '09

REMINDER: There will be a Fedora Docs Meeting today at 0001 UTC. The agenda can be found at: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings#Agenda_for_Next_Meeting

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docs November 2009