Several separate topics: I have two machine, one running FC3 stable (upgrades since RH8) and one running rawhide. Both show some of these issues.
a.) Nautilus often doesn't update. I have the "Gamin" package installed, but I don't see a "gam*" daemon running. What could be checked?
b.) Sometimes I plug in a device and HAL/GVM auto-mounts it, and pops up a nautilus window, but it never appears on the desktop. Then to unmount it, I have to use the command-line. (It also doesn't show up under "computer" in gnome).
c.) Multimedia keys don't seem to work right. If I don't run acme, they don't work. If I run acme, it says "another application is using the keyboard" or something similar. I though acme was replaced (at least I remember the control panel UI changing.)
d.) I saw in FC3T3 a nice wireless applet. That seems gone from the FC3 release. Someone told me it was merged into the "network" applet, and in fact I saw a nice screen-shot in a review of FC3 of this network applet, but the one I have doesn't have the features of the one in the screen-shot. Am I just confused or...? (The one I saw had a drop-down list of networks, etc.)
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FC2 -> FC3 Upgrade issues: 1. Vino doesn't get installed. (on 3 systems so far). 2. The new IME system UI (gimlet) doesn't get installed either, but the old one gets erased! (on 2 systems so far). Also the IME help on the fedora site says to add "gimlet" to the panel, but even when installed, the app isn't listed in the applet list as "Gimlet" but something like "Imput Method Editor" (and the package name for yumisn't gimlet either). 3. On one of my friend's machines, the upgrade totally hosed the panel configuration.
Thanks, Noah SILVA
p.s.: feel free to ignore any of these already in bugzilla, I am looking in there now. Please add anything not in bugzilla, and I will contribute comments to any issue files if I am made aware of the issue #. None of these are high priorities, but I am willing to test any fixes, etc.
man, 29.11.2004 kl. 17.14 skrev Noah Silva [Mailing list]:
Several separate topics: I have two machine, one running FC3 stable (upgrades since RH8) and one running rawhide. Both show some of these issues.
a.) Nautilus often doesn't update. I have the "Gamin" package installed, but I don't see a "gam*" daemon running. What could be checked?
I think there is a gamin bug about this. It is very reproducible if you save something from ex. firefox to desktop...
b.) Sometimes I plug in a device and HAL/GVM auto-mounts it, and pops up a nautilus window, but it never appears on the desktop. Then to unmount it, I have to use the command-line. (It also doesn't show up under "computer" in gnome).
c.) Multimedia keys don't seem to work right. If I don't run acme, they don't work. If I run acme, it says "another application is using the keyboard" or something similar. I though acme was replaced (at least I remember the control panel UI changing.)
d.) I saw in FC3T3 a nice wireless applet. That seems gone from the FC3 release. Someone told me it was merged into the "network" applet, and in fact I saw a nice screen-shot in a review of FC3 of this network applet, but the one I have doesn't have the features of the one in the screen-shot. Am I just confused or...? (The one I saw had a drop-down list of networks, etc.)
FC2 -> FC3 Upgrade issues:
- Vino doesn't get installed. (on 3 systems so far).
- The new IME system UI (gimlet) doesn't get installed either, but the
old one gets erased! (on 2 systems so far). Also the IME help on the fedora site says to add "gimlet" to the panel, but even when installed, the app isn't listed in the applet list as "Gimlet" but something like "Imput Method Editor" (and the package name for yumisn't gimlet either). 3. On one of my friend's machines, the upgrade totally hosed the panel configuration.
Thanks, Noah SILVA
p.s.: feel free to ignore any of these already in bugzilla, I am looking in there now. Please add anything not in bugzilla, and I will contribute comments to any issue files if I am made aware of the issue #. None of these are high priorities, but I am willing to test any fixes, etc.
man, 29.11.2004 kl. 17.14 skrev Noah Silva [Mailing list]:
Several separate topics: ... a.) Nautilus often doesn't update. I have the "Gamin" package installed, but I don't see a "gam*" daemon running. What could be checked?
I think there is a gamin bug about this. It is very reproducible if you save something from ex. firefox to desktop...
Yes and I have had other issues with firefox too, but how to tell if Gamin is even running. Does it run as a daemon? That was the impression I got from it's development page, thought he FAQ was empty.
thanks, Noah SILVA
Noah Silva [Mailing list] wrote:
d.) I saw in FC3T3 a nice wireless applet. That seems gone from the FC3 release. Someone told me it was merged into the "network" applet, and in fact I saw a nice screen-shot in a review of FC3 of this network applet, but the one I have doesn't have the features of the one in the screen-shot. Am I just confused or...? (The one I saw had a drop-down list of networks, etc.)
kwifimanager ?
$ rpm -qf `which kwifimanager` kdenetwork-3.3.1-1
applications / internet / kwifimanager
d.) I saw in FC3T3 a nice wireless applet. That seems gone from the FC3 release. Someone told me it was merged into the "network" applet, and in
...
screen-shot. Am I just confused or...? (The one I saw had a drop-down list of networks, etc.)
kwifimanager ?
$ rpm -qf `which kwifimanager` kdenetwork-3.3.1-1
applications / internet / kwifimanager
It's possible, but I was thinking about Gnome (as it's the default desktop). There used to be a "Wi-fi" applet, but it seemed to disappear between FC3T3 and FC3 final. As I said, there is a screenshot of something in a review of FC3 that looked like the "Network Monitor" and the Wifi applet rolled into one... but I don't have it on any machine I have installed...
thanks, noah silva
On Mon, 2004-11-29 at 12:03 -0500, Noah Silva [Mailing list] wrote:
d.) I saw in FC3T3 a nice wireless applet. That seems gone from the FC3 release. Someone told me it was merged into the "network" applet, and in
...
screen-shot. Am I just confused or...? (The one I saw had a drop-down list of networks, etc.)
make sure /etc/init.d/NetworkManager is running
If you must, load NetworkManagerInfo onto your GNOME panel
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 11:14:37 -0500 (EST), Noah Silva wrote:
- Vino doesn't get installed. (on 3 systems so far).
Should you expect it to? My understanding is... upgrades are designed to give you something as close to what you had previously.. and not the equivlalent of a fresh install. If vino or another new package or new technology is added to the distribution, upgrades are not necessarily expected or designed to pull in that new functionality if it is not required or if it does not replace existing functionality. Upgrading from fc2 to fc3 is inherently different than a fresh install of fc3. I don't think you can expect to see "new" packages installed when upgrading. Vino doesn't replace existing fc2 package set functionality, so its not clear to me that anything would require vino to being installed when doing the upgrade. Perhaps there is a misunderstanding of what the installer's upgrade option is meant to do.
- The new IME system UI (gimlet) doesn't get installed either, but the
old one gets erased! (on 2 systems so far). Also the IME help on the fedora site says to add "gimlet" to the panel, but even when installed, the app isn't listed in the applet list as "Gimlet" but something like "Imput Method Editor" (and the package name for yumisn't gimlet either).
Again... im not sure its expected that an upgrade will install this. Perhaps the packaging needs to be adjusted to provide or conflict with the older langauge switcher package to ensure it is installed as a replacement to the older language switcher functionality. Do you know the name of the package in fc2 that was removed that provided similar functionality?
And I'm not sure to what page on the website you are refering to. http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/i18n/iiimf-faq.html clearly states that applet will be listed as "InputMethod Switcher" in the applet list. The package name is iiimf-gnome-im-switcher. 'yum provides gimlet' helped me find the package. Perhaps the faq should be updated to mention the package by name for situations where the package needs to be installed. But from the looks of the faq, installation issues are not the focus, and the faq seems to assume that all the packages are already installed on the system. If an update to the faq is needed, perhaps the best thing to do is to try communicate what you think specifically should be reworded or added in the faq, and drop a note into the fedora-i18n-list mailinglist where the project leaders are more likely to read it.. or file a bug about the faq into bugzilla.
-jef
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 11:14:37 -0500 (EST), Noah Silva wrote:
- Vino doesn't get installed. (on 3 systems so far).
Should you expect it to? My understanding is... upgrades are designed to give you something as close to what you had previously.. and not the equivlalent of a fresh ... doing the upgrade. Perhaps there is a misunderstanding of what the installer's upgrade option is meant to do.
Well if the statement "Fedora 3 includes Remote Desktop" is true, then if you can say "This computer has been upgraded to Fedora 3", onw will assume that it will [by default] include remote desktop. This is how it works with most other systems. Just like when Mandrake started advertizing out of the box webcam support. If someone bought and installed it over their older mandrake version and then were told "oh well.. it doesn't work on upgrades.", I think they would be perplexed. Likewise with new Windows or Mac features. "XP now supports 'fast user switching' (new installs only)." Of course I could be wrong....
On the other hand, things that could significantly break existing software or are technically infeasible are a different animal. For example, I fully understand why new FC3 installs use LVM, but upgrades don't try to convert them the existing partitions.
- The new IME system UI (gimlet) doesn't get installed either, but the
...
the app isn't listed in the applet list as "Gimlet" but something like "Imput Method Editor" (and the package name for yumisn't gimlet either).
Again... im not sure its expected that an upgrade will install this.
I am. If you had a working IME, and when you upgrade, you no longer have working IME, that's a big problem!
Perhaps the packaging needs to be adjusted to provide or conflict with the older langauge switcher package to ensure it is installed as a replacement to the older language switcher functionality.
I would certainly hope so.
Do you know the name of the package in fc2 that was removed that provided similar functionality?
I have an FC2 system I can check, but I odn't have access to it atm. The package name was similar IIRC.
http://fedora.redhat.com/projects/i18n/iiimf-faq.html clearly states that applet will be listed as "InputMethod Switcher" in the applet list.
I am pretty sure that is where I was looking. Perhaps that has been fixed already.
The package name is iiimf-gnome-im-switcher. 'yum provides gimlet' helped me find the package. Perhaps the faq should be updated to mention the package by name for situations where the package needs to be installed. But from the looks of the faq, installation issues are
The FAQ was more for testing IIIMF, so I don't see it as a big deal. People who are reading the FAQ are (were) installing beta software, so presumably they are ready to deal with kinks and know about RPMs, etc.
I think breaking the IME on an upgrade is a big issue though.
... into the fedora-i18n-list mailinglist where the project leaders are more likely to read it.. or file a bug about the faq into bugzilla.
This is true, and a good idea.
thanks, Noah SILVA
Noah Silva [Mailing list] said:
On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 11:14:37 -0500 (EST), Noah Silva wrote:
- Vino doesn't get installed. (on 3 systems so far).
Should you expect it to? My understanding is... upgrades are designed to give you something as close to what you had previously.. and not the equivlalent of a fresh ... doing the upgrade. Perhaps there is a misunderstanding of what the installer's upgrade option is meant to do.
Well if the statement "Fedora 3 includes Remote Desktop" is true, then if you can say "This computer has been upgraded to Fedora 3", onw will assume that it will [by default] include remote desktop.
Then one would assume wrong. Anaconda upgrades have never added new packages unless they were new dependencies.
That being said, I would also point out that Vino isn't the only "Remote Desktop" solution in Fedora, and you probably already have VNC-server installed.
-
Colin Charles -
Jef Spaleta -
Kyrre Ness Sjobak -
Noah Silva [Mailing list] -
shrek-m＠gmx.de -
William Hooper