OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Folks are welcome to contribute, criticize, add-to.
-- Rex
Hello, I just love to see this: Internet: konversation
+1. However work should be done to prevent having 2 or more applications on the spin which do the same thing. eg. having konversation and ksirc on the spin (a bad idea)
Some tools which are for eye-candy and as the same time handy: yakuake and katapult.
Theming : I wish you ppl could have a look at: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-art-list/2006-December/msg00206.html
Something which I would like to see is that "a kmenu which not crowded". There are lots of things which can be done here: - in FE guidelines, propose not to add more than one item on the kmenu per gui package - .desktop files of some kcontrol plugins shouldn't be added to kmenu - perhaps the .desktop files of kontact contacts (kmail,Akregator,..) shouldn't be added to kmenu since they are easily accessible to the users.
* compiz. If F7 will be using compiz by default , perhaps the desktop-effects should be optimized for kde. There are some compiz bugs opened in respect to kde.
* Echo Icon theme Since i last heard, echo icon theme isn't compatible with kde.
* help and encourage contributors to add more and more kde packages in the Fedora world
chitlesh
Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
- compiz.
If F7 will be using compiz by default , perhaps the desktop-effects should be optimized for kde. There are some compiz bugs opened in respect to kde.
F7 is a name for a set of spins now. Each of the different spin can have very different defaults. It is possible (but may not be a good idea) that the KDE spin has Beryl as default while the GNOME one has Compiz.
Rahul
On 1/8/07, Rahul Sundaram sundaram@fedoraproject.org wrote:
Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
- compiz.
If F7 will be using compiz by default , perhaps the desktop-effects should be optimized for kde. There are some compiz bugs opened in respect to kde.
F7 is a name for a set of spins now. Each of the different spin can have very different defaults. It is possible (but may not be a good idea) that the KDE spin has Beryl as default while the GNOME one has Compiz.
I don't mind whether it's beryl or compiz by default as long as the Fedora packager responds in a 2 weeks delay. And at the same time, well integrated in the kde desktop.
Chitlesh
On Mon, 2007-01-08 at 23:02 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
However work should be done to prevent having 2 or more applications on the spin which do the same thing. eg. having konversation and ksirc on the spin (a bad idea)
On a live CD this would be true (and I hope you KDE guys will send patches for a fedora-livecd-kde subpackage once the fedora-livecd SRPM is imported into Extras^WThe Fedora Package Collection) but in a spin (e.g. well-defined subset of packages in the Fedora Package Collection) I think it's fine to have multiple programs with overlapping functionality.
A spin, as I see it, will define what options people have in the installer and it's not unlikely some people want to choose konversation, some people want xchat (or not, thinking out loud) and others want ksirc. A default install, however, should only choose one. But that's all at the discretion of the Fedora KDE spin maintainers I suppose.
Then again, I know little about KDE, just offering my thoughts on the subject. Thanks.
David
David Zeuthen wrote:
On Mon, 2007-01-08 at 23:02 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
However work should be done to prevent having 2 or more applications on the spin which do the same thing. eg. having konversation and ksirc on the spin (a bad idea)
On a live CD this would be true (and I hope you KDE guys will send patches for a fedora-livecd-kde subpackage once the fedora-livecd SRPM is imported into Extras^WThe Fedora Package Collection)
any eta on fedora-livecd availability (in Extras, whatever)?
-- Rex
Rex Dieter wrote:
David Zeuthen wrote:
On Mon, 2007-01-08 at 23:02 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
However work should be done to prevent having 2 or more applications on the spin which do the same thing. eg. having konversation and ksirc on the spin (a bad idea)
On a live CD this would be true (and I hope you KDE guys will send patches for a fedora-livecd-kde subpackage once the fedora-livecd SRPM is imported into Extras^WThe Fedora Package Collection)
any eta on fedora-livecd availability (in Extras, whatever)?
Pending review.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=220635 https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=220637
Rahul
Rahul Sundaram wrote:
Rex Dieter wrote:
David Zeuthen wrote:
On Mon, 2007-01-08 at 23:02 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
However work should be done to prevent having 2 or more applications on the spin which do the same thing. eg. having konversation and ksirc on the spin (a bad idea)
On a live CD this would be true (and I hope you KDE guys will send patches for a fedora-livecd-kde subpackage once the fedora-livecd SRPM is imported into Extras^WThe Fedora Package Collection)
any eta on fedora-livecd availability (in Extras, whatever)?
Pending review.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=220635 https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=220637
Duh, I should have known better to look first. I'll try to (help) review this within the next day or 2.
-- Rex
On 1/8/07, Rex Dieter rdieter@math.unl.edu wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Hello, Knowing the fact, that this is that very first release of a Fedora KDE spin, shouldn't we encourage the KDE sig to be "owners" and at the same time help in creating a nice little fedora kde sig ?
Chitlesh
Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
On 1/8/07, Rex Dieter rdieter@math.unl.edu wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Knowing the fact, that this is that very first release of a Fedora KDE spin, shouldn't we encourage the KDE sig to be "owners" and at the same time help in creating a nice little fedora kde sig?
Sure, more the merrier.
-- Rex
On 1/8/07, Rex Dieter rdieter@math.unl.edu wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Folks are welcome to contribute, criticize, add-to.
-- Rex
I hope you don't mind if I be a bit verbose:
* Browser: konqueror
Cool. I kinda like the fact that there is no Flash support for Konqueror. I use Seamonkey for my heavy browsing myself.
* Irc: konversation
Recently switched to this from Chatzilla, I love how well it works
* IM: kopete
Great application. Good choice.
* office: koffice
I going to assume that the filters will be part of the spin. If so, good choice.
* PDF: KPDF
No real preference or dispute here
* audio(most): amarok
I'm going to assume that the xine engine will also be installed?
* Media Burner: K3b
Why exactly is K3B under the multimedia section? Burning MP3/Audio CDs is only half of what it could do.
* System Cleanup: kleansweep
Never heard of it. Will Google eventually
* Project management and groupware: Task Juggler
* Home user backup?
While I am _still_ (I am loosing a lot of time) working on system-config-backup for Fedora. It seems that the KDE way would be http://konserve.sourceforge.net/
Bellow here I would like to put forth other suggests, based on applications currently in use on my desktop
* Organizer and Email: Kontact
* Photo organisation: Digikam
* Photo Editing: Krita (incase not considered as part of KOffice)
I would also like to put forward a request that a verbose, clearly worded document on rolling Fedora compatible RPMSs be produced and well publicized.
I have attempted several times to read through, and follow accordingly the existing available documents on the topic. I have also received recommendations to read other .spec files. For what ever reason (I have near ruled out my own laziness) I find following the tutorial towards an end to be difficult.
I say this (instead of starting a new thread) as I would like to actively start rolling packages that are KDE centric....with mind to Fedora compatible items from kde-look.org.
Lastly, I would like to suggest, if the Gtk-QT engine is used, that some exclusion be made for the system-config tools. I think there are multiple benefits in have the system-config tools look different from the persons desktop applications AND yet "universally" alike.
Good luck with the KDE spin. Anything towards having me not have to `rpm -e gdm` post Fedora install has my blessings.
Peace
On Monday 08 January 2007 07:25pm, Arthur Pemberton wrote: [snip]
I hope you don't mind if I be a bit verbose:
Not at all. As a long time KDE user (also with years of simultaneous Gnome usage), I'd like to give my $/50 in response.
- Browser: konqueror
Cool. I kinda like the fact that there is no Flash support for Konqueror. I use Seamonkey for my heavy browsing myself.
Huh? I've used (and still do) Flash with Konqueror on some boxes (don't bother others) for years.
- Irc: konversation
Recently switched to this from Chatzilla, I love how well it works
Agree.
- IM: kopete
Great application. Good choice.
Agree.
- office: koffice
I going to assume that the filters will be part of the spin. If so, good choice.
Love koffice.
- PDF: KPDF
No real preference or dispute here
I prefer kpdf, but I also use Adobe Reader sometimes.
- audio(most): amarok
I'm going to assume that the xine engine will also be installed?
amarok with the xine engine works great here. I'd like to see gstreamer get back in the game, too.
I'd also like to see better integration/easier configuration of netaudio. This probably requires more work than just packaging, though. Perhaps some good documentation being included could help.
- Media Burner: K3b
Why exactly is K3B under the multimedia section? Burning MP3/Audio CDs is only half of what it could do.
No idea. I think it's more a utility than a "multimedia" app. But does "Media Burner:" mean media as in removable media?
- System Cleanup: kleansweep
Never heard of it. Will Google eventually
Same here.
Project management and groupware: Task Juggler
Home user backup?
While I am _still_ (I am loosing a lot of time) working on system-config-backup for Fedora. It seems that the KDE way would be http://konserve.sourceforge.net/
Agree.
Bellow here I would like to put forth other suggests, based on applications currently in use on my desktop
- Organizer and Email: Kontact
Excellent app. I'm using it right now :) .
Photo organisation: Digikam
Photo Editing: Krita (incase not considered as part of KOffice)
I think it is considered part of koffice. It's a good app, though I find I still use gimp sometimes, as it is the best-of-breed app for this category.
I would also like to put forward a request that a verbose, clearly worded document on rolling Fedora compatible RPMSs be produced and well publicized.
Good idea.
I have attempted several times to read through, and follow accordingly the existing available documents on the topic. I have also received recommendations to read other .spec files. For what ever reason (I have near ruled out my own laziness) I find following the tutorial towards an end to be difficult.
I say this (instead of starting a new thread) as I would like to actively start rolling packages that are KDE centric....with mind to Fedora compatible items from kde-look.org.
That would be excellent.
Lastly, I would like to suggest, if the Gtk-QT engine is used, that some exclusion be made for the system-config tools. I think there are multiple benefits in have the system-config tools look different from the persons desktop applications AND yet "universally" alike.
I like that idea.
Good luck with the KDE spin. Anything towards having me not have to `rpm -e gdm` post Fedora install has my blessings.
:)
On 01/09/2007 04:58 AM, Lamont Peterson wrote:
On Monday 08 January 2007 07:25pm, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
Lastly, I would like to suggest, if the Gtk-QT engine is used, that some exclusion be made for the system-config tools. I think there are multiple benefits in have the system-config tools look different from the persons desktop applications AND yet "universally" alike.
I like that idea.
I don't. I like to be able to set fonts, colours, look&feel, etc. once and for all apps and not having to scratch my head where on earth do I do that for applications that for some reason do not obey my settings. Q: How would I do that for system-config anyway then?
Arthur, can you elaborate on the benefits?
Regards, Dariusz
Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
On 1/9/07, Dariusz J. Garbowski thuforuk@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
On 01/09/2007 04:58 AM, Lamont Peterson wrote:
On Monday 08 January 2007 07:25pm, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
Lastly, I would like to suggest, if the Gtk-QT engine is used, that some exclusion be made for the system-config tools. I think there are multiple benefits in have the system-config tools look different from the persons desktop applications AND yet "universally" alike.
I like that idea.
I don't. I like to be able to set fonts, colours, look&feel, etc. once and for all apps and not having to scratch my head where on earth do I do that for applications that for some reason do not obey my settings. Q: How would I do that for system-config anyway then?
Arthur, can you elaborate on the benefits?
1) Easy to recognize and system applications (generally ran as root) 2) Everything would be "exactly" in the same place on every Fedora install 3) If tutorials including the system-config tools are put up, only one set will be necessary, not one for Gtk+ and one for Gtk-Qt
Arthur Pemberton <pemboa <at> gmail.com> writes:
- If tutorials including the system-config tools are put up, only one
set will be necessary, not one for Gtk+ and one for Gtk-Qt
The differences between Clearlooks and Plastik are not so big that they warrant a separate version of the tutorials. Heck, a lot of documentation uses screenshots taken on Window$ XP, or on another distribution with a very different theme than Fedora's, or with an excentric custom theme. Also, a lot of the regular GTK+ styles look more different from Clearlooks than Plastik does.
Kevin Kofler
On 1/9/07, Kevin Kofler kevin.kofler@chello.at wrote:
Arthur Pemberton <pemboa <at> gmail.com> writes:
- If tutorials including the system-config tools are put up, only one
set will be necessary, not one for Gtk+ and one for Gtk-Qt
The differences between Clearlooks and Plastik are not so big that they warrant a separate version of the tutorials. Heck, a lot of documentation uses screenshots taken on Window$ XP, or on another distribution with a very different theme than Fedora's, or with an excentric custom theme. Also, a lot of the regular GTK+ styles look more different from Clearlooks than Plastik does.
Kevin Kofler
Fair enough, I guess we'll see how that plays out.
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 20:08 +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Arthur Pemberton <pemboa <at> gmail.com> writes:
- If tutorials including the system-config tools are put up, only one
set will be necessary, not one for Gtk+ and one for Gtk-Qt
The differences between Clearlooks and Plastik are not so big that they warrant a separate version of the tutorials. Heck, a lot of documentation uses screenshots taken on Window$ XP, or on another distribution with a very different theme than Fedora's, or with an excentric custom theme. Also, a lot of the regular GTK+ styles look more different from Clearlooks than Plastik does.
Kevin Kofler
/+1.
I'm running a large number of GNOME application on my KDE desktop and they integrate nicely.
KDE: Skin: Plastik Icons: Umicons.
GNOME: (Forced using .gtkrc) Skin: Clearlooks. Icons: Gant.Xfce
- Gilboa
Arthur Pemberton wrote:
- Home user backup?
While I am _still_ (I am loosing a lot of time) working on system-config-backup for Fedora. It seems that the KDE way would be http://konserve.sourceforge.net/
Fedora already has PyBackPack under review now which serves the same purpose
" A GTK+ application written in Python to backup and restore files onto CDR, USB stick or SSH host. This was produced for the Fedora Project as part of the Google Summer of Code program, working under Elliot Lee."
Rahul
Arthur Pemberton wrote:
I would also like to put forward a request that a verbose, clearly worded document on rolling Fedora compatible RPMSs be produced and well publicized.
Well, the closest to that we have atm is likely the Packaging Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging/Guidelines
Lastly, I would like to suggest, if the Gtk-QT engine is used, that some exclusion be made for the system-config tools.
Don't think that's possible, though even if it were, I don't think that would be a wise idea. (:
-- Rex
On 1/9/07, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
Good luck with the KDE spin. Anything towards having me not have to `rpm -e gdm` post Fedora install has my blessings.
I've just installed a FC6 KDE only. GDM is installed by default.
I've removed gdm and switchdesk to kdm http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=375815378&context=photostream&si...
I haven't installed firefox and evolution. But what annoys me is that in that case, the small icons on the kicker (web browser and mail client), will popup http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=375815382&size=o when clicked. This should be corrected if evolution isn't among the kde spin.
I wouldn't consider kdmtheme as part of the kde spin since it's just another addon which could remove the hardwork of FedoraArtwork, well that could be downloaded via yum.
I'll publish the full list of rpms after the updates to rawhide.
Chitlesh
Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
On 1/9/07, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
Good luck with the KDE spin. Anything towards having me not have to `rpm -e gdm` post Fedora install has my blessings.
I've just installed a FC6 KDE only. GDM is installed by default.
I've removed gdm and switchdesk to kdm http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=375815378&context=photostream&si...
I haven't installed firefox and evolution. But what annoys me is that in that case, the small icons on the kicker (web browser and mail client), will popup http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=375815382&size=o when clicked. This should be corrected if evolution isn't among the kde spin.
The htmlview and launchmail in FC7 should fallback to *any* browser in a list of fallbacks if the configured browser or mail client doesn't exist. This should help this case... although htmlview could probably use a lot more cleanup.
Warren Togami wtogami@redhat.com
Warren Togami wrote:
The htmlview and launchmail in FC7 should fallback to *any* browser in a list of fallbacks if the configured browser or mail client doesn't exist. This should help this case... although htmlview could probably use a lot more cleanup.
xdg-open pretty much deprecates htmlview, imo. It'll open arbitrary file,URL using the current desktop's default app for that mimetype.
-- Rex
Rex Dieter wrote:
Warren Togami wrote:
The htmlview and launchmail in FC7 should fallback to *any* browser in a list of fallbacks if the configured browser or mail client doesn't exist. This should help this case... although htmlview could probably use a lot more cleanup.
xdg-open pretty much deprecates htmlview, imo. It'll open arbitrary file,URL using the current desktop's default app for that mimetype.
-- Rex
Which MIME system does it use?
Is this an upstream freedesktop.org standard?
Has both GNOME and KDE accepted xdg-open?
Warren Togami wtogami@redhat.com
On Wed, Jan 31, 2007 at 10:56:10PM -0500, Warren Togami wrote:
Which MIME system does it use?
Is this an upstream freedesktop.org standard?
Has both GNOME and KDE accepted xdg-open?
It is a simple script. It detects the desktop and runs the gnome, kde or xfce command apropriately to open a file. If gnome, kde or xfce aren't running, it tries mimeopen (a perl desktop agnostic script that follows the freedesktop standarrd) if installed, and then uses what is in BROWSER falling back to firefox (if I recall well).
-- Pat
On Wed, 2007-01-31 at 22:56 -0500, Warren Togami wrote:
Rex Dieter wrote:
Warren Togami wrote:
The htmlview and launchmail in FC7 should fallback to *any* browser in a list of fallbacks if the configured browser or mail client doesn't exist. This should help this case... although htmlview could probably use a lot more cleanup.
xdg-open pretty much deprecates htmlview, imo. It'll open arbitrary file,URL using the current desktop's default app for that mimetype.
-- Rex
Which MIME system does it use?
Is this an upstream freedesktop.org standard?
Has both GNOME and KDE accepted xdg-open?
There is nothing to accept here, really. The xdg- wrapper scripts are meant for third-party software that wants to work on multiple desktops.
They were never intended to be pushed back into the desktops themselves, At least that was not case when the Portland project was started.
Matthias Clasen wrote:
On Wed, 2007-01-31 at 22:56 -0500, Warren Togami wrote:
Which MIME system does it use?
That of the current desktop in use.
Is this an upstream freedesktop.org standard?
yes.
Has both GNOME and KDE accepted xdg-open?
Yes, more or less, modulo a few certain folks. (:
There is nothing to accept here, really. The xdg- wrapper scripts are meant for third-party software that wants to work on multiple desktops.
They were never intended to be pushed back into the desktops themselves, At least that was not case when the Portland project was started.
I have it on good authority xdg-utils will be included (or at least proposed for inclusion) in the next iteration of LSB, so, whatever the original intent, it's here, and it's here to stay (for awhile anyway, until something better comes along).
-- Rex
On 2/1/07, Warren Togami wrote:
The htmlview and launchmail in FC7 should fallback to *any* browser in a list of fallbacks if the configured browser or mail client doesn't exist. This should help this case... although htmlview could probably use a lot more cleanup.
Cool that could help :)
The previous list I sent could be useful if someone wants to strip down useless apps from the kde spin.
However, what will be status of the pup applet on the kicker, knowing the fact that in fc6 kde it isn't on the kicker and hence the service yum-updatesd is no more useful.
Chitlesh
On 1/31/07, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
I'll publish the full list of rpms after the updates to rawhide.
here is the list a2ps-4.13b-60.fc7 acl-2.2.39-1.1 acpid-1.0.4-5 alsa-lib-1.0.14-0.2.rc2.fc7 alsa-utils-1.0.14-0.3.rc2.fc7 anacron-2.3-45.fc7 apmd-3.2.2-5 arts-1.5.6-1.fc7 aspell-0.60.5-2.fc7 aspell-en-6.0-2.1 at-3.1.10-6.fc7 atk-1.13.2-1.fc7 attr-2.4.32-1.1 audiofile-0.2.6-5 audit-libs-1.3.1-2.fc7 audit-libs-python-1.3.1-2.fc7 authconfig-5.3.13-1.fc7 authconfig-gtk-5.3.13-1.fc7 autofs-5.0.1-0.rc3.13 autorun-3.20-1.1 avahi-0.6.16-2.fc7 avahi-glib-0.6.16-2.fc7 avahi-qt3-0.6.16-2.fc7 basesystem-8.0-5.1.1 bash-3.2-4.fc7 bc-1.06-23 beecrypt-4.1.2-12 bind-libs-9.3.4-2.fc7 bind-utils-9.3.4-2.fc7 binutils-2.17.50.0.9-1 bitmap-fonts-0.3-5.1.1 bitstream-vera-fonts-1.10-7 bluez-gnome-0.6-1.fc7 bluez-libs-3.9-1.fc7 bluez-utils-3.9-1.fc7 busybox-1.2.2-4.fc7 bzip2-1.0.4-1.fc7 bzip2-libs-1.0.4-1.fc7 cairo-1.3.12-1.fc7 ccid-1.1.0-2 cdparanoia-libs-alpha9.8-27.2 chkconfig-1.3.30-1 chkfontpath-1.10.1-1.1 compat-db-4.3.29-2.fc7 comps-extras-11.1-1.1 coolkey-1.0.1-15.fc7 coreutils-6.7-3.fc7 cpio-2.6-23.fc7 cpp-4.1.1-54 cpuspeed-1.2.1-1.53.fc7 cracklib-2.8.9-7 cracklib-dicts-2.8.9-7 crash-4.0-3.3 crontabs-1.10-12.fc7 cryptsetup-luks-1.0.3-3.fc7 cups-1.2.7-7.fc7 cups-libs-1.2.7-7.fc7 curl-7.16.1-1.fc7 cyrus-sasl-2.1.22-5 cyrus-sasl-lib-2.1.22-5 cyrus-sasl-plain-2.1.22-5 db4-4.5.20-4.fc7 dbus-1.0.1-9.fc6 dbus-glib-0.71-4.fc7 dbus-python-0.80.1-1.fc7 dbus-x11-1.0.1-9.fc6 dejavu-lgc-fonts-2.13-1 desktop-backgrounds-basic-2.0-37 desktop-file-utils-0.12-1.fc7 desktop-printing-0.20-3.fc7 device-mapper-1.02.17-1.fc7 device-mapper-multipath-0.4.7-9.fc7 dhcdbd-2.2-1.fc7 dhclient-3.0.5-11.fc7 dhcpv6_client-0.10-35.fc7 diffutils-2.8.1-16.fc7 dmidecode-2.7-1.26.1.fc6 dmraid-1.0.0.rc14-1.fc7 docbook-dtds-1.0-30.1 dos2unix-3.1-27.1 dosfstools-2.11-6.1.fc7 dump-0.4b41-5.fc7 e2fsprogs-1.39-9 e2fsprogs-libs-1.39-9 echo-icon-theme-0.1-6.fc7 ed-0.4-1 eject-2.1.5-5 elfutils-libelf-0.125-3.fc7 enscript-1.6.4-6.fc7 esound-0.2.36-4.fc7 esound-libs-0.2.36-4.fc7 ethtool-5-1.fc7 expat-1.95.8-9 fbset-2.1-24.fc7 fedora-logos-6.0.90-1.fc7 fedora-release-6.90-2 fedora-release-notes-6-3 file-4.19-2.fc7 file-libs-4.19-2.fc7 filesystem-2.4.1-1 findutils-4.2.29-2 finger-0.17-32.2.1.1 firstboot-1.4.29-1.fc7 firstboot-tui-1.4.29-1.fc7 flac-1.1.2-27 fontconfig-2.4.2-2.fc7 foomatic-3.0.2-45.fc7 freetype-2.3.0-2.fc7 fribidi-0.10.7-5.1 ftp-0.17-35.fc7 gamin-0.1.8-3.fc7 gawk-3.1.5-14.fc7 GConf2-2.16.0-4.fc7 gdbm-1.8.0-26.2.1 gettext-0.16.1-3.fc7 ghostscript-8.15.3-7.fc7 ghostscript-fonts-5.50-14.fc7 glib2-2.12.9-1.fc7 glibc-2.5.90-15 glibc-common-2.5.90-15 glx-utils-6.5.2-4.fc7 gmp-4.1.4-11 gnome-keyring-0.7.3-1.fc7 gnome-mime-data-2.4.3-2.fc7 gnome-mount-0.5-3.fc7 gnome-python2-2.17.2-1.fc7 gnome-python2-bonobo-2.17.2-1.fc7 gnome-python2-canvas-2.17.2-1.fc7 gnome-python2-gconf-2.17.2-1.fc7 gnome-python2-gnomevfs-2.17.2-1.fc7 gnome-vfs2-2.17.90-1.fc7 gnupg-1.4.6-3 gnutls-1.4.1-2 gpg-pubkey-1ac70ce6-41bebeef gpg-pubkey-4f2a6fd2-3f9d9d3b gphoto2-2.3.1-3.fc7 gpm-1.20.1-80.fc7 grep-2.5.1-57.fc7 groff-1.18.1.4-2 grub-0.97-13 gtk2-2.10.9-2.fc7 gtk2-engines-2.9.2-1.fc7 gtk-qt-engine-0.70-4.20061211svn.fc7 gzip-1.3.9-2.fc7 hal-0.5.8.1-6.fc7 hal-cups-utils-0.6.5-1.fc7 hdparm-6.9-1 hesiod-3.1.0-8 hicolor-icon-theme-0.10-1 hpijs-1.6.12-1.fc7 hplip-1.6.12-1.fc7 htdig-3.2.0b6-9.fc7 htmlview-3.0.0-15.fc7 hwdata-0.195-1 ifd-egate-0.05-15 im-chooser-0.3.4-1.fc7 info-4.8-15 initscripts-8.48-1 iproute-2.6.19-1.fc7 ipsec-tools-0.6.6-1 iptables-1.3.7-1.1 iptables-ipv6-1.3.7-1.1 iptstate-1.4-1.1.2.2 iputils-20020927-41.fc6 irda-utils-0.9.18-1.fc7 irqbalance-0.55-2.fc7 jwhois-3.2.3-10 katapult-0.3.1.4-3.fc7 kbd-1.12-21 kdeaccessibility-3.5.5-0.1.fc6 kdeaddons-3.5.5-0.1.fc6 kdeartwork-3.5.5-0.1.fc6 kdebase-3.5.5-0.4.fc6 kdegraphics-3.5.5-0.1.fc6 kdelibs-3.5.5-1.fc7 kdemultimedia-3.5.5-0.1.fc6 kdenetwork-3.5.5-0.1.fc6 kdepim-3.5.5-1.fc7 kdeutils-3.5.5-3.fc7 kdmtheme-1.1.2-4.fc7 kdnssd-avahi-0.1.3-0.1.20060713svn.fc6 kernel-2.6.19-1.2914.fc7 kernel-2.6.19-1.2916.fc7 kernel-headers-2.6.19-1.2916.fc7 kexec-tools-1.101-58.fc7 kleansweep-0.2.9-3.fc7 kmenu-gnome-0.6.2-1.fc7 kpartx-0.4.7-9.fc7 krb5-auth-dialog-0.7-1 krb5-libs-1.6-1 krb5-workstation-1.6-1 ksh-20060214-1.1 kudzu-1.2.64-2 lcms-1.15-2 less-394-6.fc7 lftp-3.5.9-1.fc7 libacl-2.2.39-1.1 libart_lgpl-2.3.17-4 libattr-2.4.32-1.1 libbonobo-2.17.90-1.fc7 libbonoboui-2.17.90-1.fc7 libcap-1.10-25 libcroco-0.6.1-2.1 libdaemon-0.10-3.2 libdhcp-1.19-3.fc7 libdhcp4client-3.0.5-11.fc7 libdhcp6client-0.10-35.fc7 libdmx-1.0.2-3.1 libdrm-2.3.0-2.fc7 libevent-1.1a-3.2.1 libexif-0.6.13-2 libfontenc-1.0.4-2.fc7 libFS-1.0.0-3.1 libgcc-4.1.1-54 libgcrypt-1.2.3-2 libglade2-2.6.0-3.fc7 libgnome-2.17.90-1.fc7 libgnomecanvas-2.14.0-5.fc7 libgnomecups-0.2.2-8 libgnomeui-2.17.90-1.fc7 libgomp-4.1.1-54 libgpg-error-1.4-2 libgsf-1.14.3-2 libgssapi-0.10-1 libICE-1.0.3-1.fc7 libIDL-0.8.7-2.fc7 libidn-0.6.8-4 libieee1284-0.2.9-4 libjpeg-6b-37 libmng-1.0.9-5.1 libnl-1.0-0.10.pre5.4 libnotify-0.4.3-2.fc7 libogg-1.1.3-2.fc6 libpcap-0.9.5-1.fc7 libpng-1.2.10-7 libraw1394-1.2.1-1.fc6 librsvg2-2.16.1-1.fc7 libsane-hpaio-1.6.12-1.fc7 libselinux-1.34.0-3.fc7 libselinux-python-1.34.0-3.fc7 libsemanage-1.10.0-2.fc7 libsepol-1.16.0-1.fc7 libSM-1.0.2-1 libstdc++-4.1.1-54 libsysfs-2.1.0-1.fc7 libtermcap-2.0.8-46.1 libthai-0.1.7-5.fc7 libtheora-1.0alpha7-1 libtiff-3.8.2-7.fc7 libusb-0.1.12-6.fc7 libuser-0.55-2 libutempter-1.1.4-3.fc6 libvolume_id-104-1 libvorbis-1.1.2-1.2.1 libwnck-2.16.2-1.fc7 libX11-1.0.3-7.fc7 libXau-1.0.3-1.fc7 libXaw-1.0.2-8.1 libXcomposite-0.3.1-1 libXcursor-1.1.8-1 libXdamage-1.0.4-1 libXdmcp-1.0.2-2.fc7 libXext-1.0.1-2.1 libXfixes-4.0.3-1 libXfont-1.2.6-2.fc7 libXfontcache-1.0.4-1.fc7 libXft-2.1.12-1.fc7 libXi-1.0.2-1 libXinerama-1.0.1-2.1 libxkbfile-1.0.4-1.fc7 libxml2-2.6.27-2 libxml2-python-2.6.27-2 libXmu-1.0.3-1.fc7 libXpm-3.5.6-1 libXrandr-1.1.2-1.fc7 libXrender-0.9.2-1.fc7 libXres-1.0.2-1.fc7 libXScrnSaver-1.1.2-1.fc7 libxslt-1.1.20-1.fc6 libXt-1.0.4-1.fc7 libXTrap-1.0.0-3.1 libXtst-1.0.1-3.1 libXv-1.0.3-1.fc7 libXxf86dga-1.0.1-3.1 libXxf86misc-1.0.1-3.1 libXxf86vm-1.0.1-3.1 linuxwacom-0.7.4_1-2.1 lm_sensors-2.10.1-1.fc7 lockdev-1.0.1-10 logrotate-3.7.4-11.fc7 logwatch-7.3.2-5.fc7 lsof-4.78-3 lvm2-2.02.21-1.fc7 m4-1.4.8-1 mailcap-2.1.23-1.fc6 mailx-8.1.1-44.2.2 make-3.81-3.fc7 MAKEDEV-3.23-1.2 man-1.6e-2.fc7 man-pages-2.43-4.fc7 mcstrans-0.1.10-1.fc7 mdadm-2.6-1.fc7 mesa-libGL-6.5.2-4.fc7 mesa-libGLU-6.5.2-4.fc7 metacity-2.17.5-1.fc7 mgetty-1.1.33-10.fc7 microcode_ctl-1.13-1.37.fc7 mingetty-1.07-5.2.2 mkbootdisk-1.5.3-2.1 mkinitrd-6.0.6-3 mktemp-1.5-24.fc7 mlocate-0.15-2 module-init-tools-3.3-0.pre3.1.6.fc7 mtools-3.9.10-3.fc7 mtr-0.71-3.1 nano-1.3.12-1.1 nash-6.0.6-3 nc-1.84-10.fc6 ncurses-5.6-2.20070120.fc7 neon-0.25.5-5.1 net-snmp-libs-5.4-8.fc7 net-tools-1.60-77.fc7 NetworkManager-0.6.5-0.cvs20061025.fc7.1 NetworkManager-glib-0.6.5-0.cvs20061025.fc7.1 newt-0.52.4-3.fc7 nfs-utils-1.0.10-5.fc6 nfs-utils-lib-1.0.8-7.2 notification-daemon-0.3.6-1.fc7 notify-python-0.1.0-4.fc7 nscd-2.5.90-15 nspr-4.6.5-1 nss-3.11.4-5.fc7 nss_db-2.2-35.1 nss_ldap-253-4 nss-tools-3.11.4-5.fc7 ntp-4.2.4-4.fc7 ntsysv-1.3.30-1 numactl-0.9.8-2.fc7 openjade-1.3.2-27 openldap-2.3.30-1.1.fc7 opensp-1.5.2-3.1 openssh-4.5p1-2.fc7 openssh-askpass-4.5p1-2.fc7 openssh-clients-4.5p1-2.fc7 openssh-server-4.5p1-2.fc7 openssl-0.9.8b-12.fc7 ORBit2-2.14.5-2.fc7 pam-0.99.7.1-1.fc7 pam_ccreds-3-5 pam_krb5-2.2.11-1 pam_passwdqc-1.0.2-1.2.2 pam_pkcs11-0.5.3-22 pam_smb-1.1.7-7.2.1 pango-1.15.5-1.fc7 paps-0.6.6-17.fc7 parted-1.8.2-4.fc7 passwd-0.74-2 patch-2.5.4-29.2.2 pax-3.4-1.2.2 pciutils-2.2.3-4 pcmciautils-014-5 pcre-7.0-2 pcsc-lite-1.3.2-1 pcsc-lite-libs-1.3.2-1 perl-5.8.8-12.fc7 perl-String-CRC32-1.4-2.fc6 pilot-link-0.12.1-4.fc7 pinfo-0.6.9-2.fc7 pirut-1.2.10-1.fc7 pkgconfig-0.21-3.fc7 pm-utils-0.19.1-6.fc7 policycoreutils-1.34.1-3.fc7 popt-1.10.2-39.fc7 portmap-4.0-65.3 ppp-2.4.4-2 prelink-0.3.10-1 procmail-3.22-18 procps-3.2.7-8 psacct-6.3.2-43.fc7 psmisc-22.2-5 psutils-1.17-26.1 pycairo-1.2.6-2.fc7 pygobject2-2.12.3-2.fc7 pygtk2-2.10.3-7.fc7 pygtk2-libglade-2.10.3-7.fc7 pyorbit-2.14.1-2 PyQt-3.17-3 python-2.5-9.fc7 python-libs-2.5-9.fc7 python-numeric-24.2-3 python-urlgrabber-2.9.9-5.fc7 pyxf86config-0.3.32-1.fc7 PyXML-0.8.4-5 qt-3.3.7-2.fc7 quota-3.13-1.3.fc7 rdate-1.4-6 rdist-6.1.5-44 readahead-1.3-5 readline-5.2-2.fc7 redhat-artwork-5.0.8-4.fc7 redhat-lsb-3.1-12.2 redhat-menus-7.8.9-4.fc7 rhgb-0.16.4-4.fc7 rhpl-0.201-2 rhpxl-0.42-1.fc7 rmt-0.4b41-5.fc7 rng-utils-2.0-1.14.1.fc6 rootfiles-8.1-1.1.1 rpm-4.4.2-39.fc7 rpm-libs-4.4.2-39.fc7 rpm-python-4.4.2-39.fc7 rp-pppoe-3.5-32.1 rsh-0.17-39.fc7 rsync-2.6.9-1 samba-client-3.0.23c-2 samba-common-3.0.23c-2 sane-backends-1.0.18-5.fc7 sane-backends-libs-1.0.18-5.fc7 scrollkeeper-0.3.14-10.fc7 SDL-1.2.10-9 sed-4.1.5-7.fc7 selinux-policy-2.5.2-2.fc7 selinux-policy-targeted-2.5.2-2.fc7 sendmail-8.13.8-4 setarch-2.0-3.fc7 setserial-2.17-19.2.2 setup-2.6.2-1.fc7 setuptool-1.19.2-2 sgml-common-0.6.3-19 shadow-utils-4.0.18.1-9.fc7 shared-mime-info-0.19-2.fc7 sip-4.5.2-1 slang-2.0.7-1.fc7 smartmontools-5.36-5.fc7 sox-12.18.1-1 specspo-12-1 sqlite-3.3.6-2 startup-notification-0.8-4.1 stunnel-4.20-2 sudo-1.6.8p12-11.fc7 switchdesk-4.0.8-6 symlinks-1.2-26.fc7 synaptics-0.14.4-8.fc6 sysklogd-1.4.1-43.fc7 sysklogd-1.4.1-44.fc7 syslinux-3.31-2 sysreport-1.4.3-9 system-config-date-1.8.11-1.fc7 system-config-display-1.0.48-1.fc7 system-config-keyboard-1.2.11-1.fc7 system-config-language-1.1.16-1.fc7 system-config-lvm-1.0.18-1.2.FC6 system-config-network-1.3.96-1.fc6 system-config-network-tui-1.3.96-1.fc6 system-config-printer-0.7.49-1.fc7 system-config-printer-libs-0.7.49-1.fc7 system-config-rootpassword-1.1.10-1 system-config-securitylevel-1.7.0-1.fc7 system-config-securitylevel-tui-1.7.0-1.fc7 system-config-services-0.9.4-1.fc7 system-config-soundcard-2.0.6-2.fc7 system-config-users-1.2.51-1.fc7 SysVinit-2.86-14 talk-0.17-29.2.2 tar-1.15.1-25.fc7 tcpdump-3.9.5-2.fc7 tcp_wrappers-7.6-41 tcp_wrappers-libs-7.6-41 tcsh-6.14-13 telnet-0.17-37 termcap-5.5-1.20060701.1 time-1.7-28.fc7 tmpwatch-2.9.10-1 traceroute-2.0.3-1.1.fc7 tree-1.5.0-5.fc7 ttmkfdir-3.0.9-24.fc7 tzdata-2007a-1.fc7 udev-104-1 unix2dos-2.2-26.2.2 unzip-5.52-2.2.1 urw-fonts-2.3-6.1.1 usbutils-0.71-2.1 usermode-1.87-3 usermode-gtk-1.87-3 util-linux-2.13-0.49.fc7 vconfig-1.9-3.fc7 vim-minimal-7.0.188-3 vixie-cron-4.1-73.fc7 vnc-server-4.1.2-10.fc7 vte-0.15.2-1.fc7 wget-1.10.2-12.fc7 which-2.16-8 wireless-tools-28-1.fc6 words-3.0-10.fc7 wpa_supplicant-0.4.9-1.fc7 xkeyboard-config-0.8-7.fc6 xml-common-0.6.3-19 xorg-x11-apps-7.1-4.fc7 xorg-x11-drivers-7.1-3 xorg-x11-drv-acecad-1.1.0-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-aiptek-1.0.1-2 xorg-x11-drv-apm-1.1.1-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-ark-0.6.0-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-ast-0.81.0-3 xorg-x11-drv-ati-6.6.3-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-calcomp-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-chips-1.1.1-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-cirrus-1.1.0-2.fc6 xorg-x11-drv-citron-2.2.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-cyrix-1.1.0-4 xorg-x11-drv-digitaledge-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-dmc-1.1.0-2 xorg-x11-drv-dummy-0.2.0-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-dynapro-1.1.0-2 xorg-x11-drv-elo2300-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-elographics-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-evdev-1.1.2-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-fbdev-0.3.1-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-fpit-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-glint-1.1.1-4.1 xorg-x11-drv-hyperpen-1.1.0-2 xorg-x11-drv-i128-1.2.0-4 xorg-x11-drv-i740-1.1.0-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-i810-1.6.5-11.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-jamstudio-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-joystick-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-keyboard-1.1.0-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-magellan-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-magictouch-1.0.0.5-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-mga-1.4.6.1-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-microtouch-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-mouse-1.2.1-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-mutouch-1.1.0-2 xorg-x11-drv-neomagic-1.1.1-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-nsc-2.8.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-nv-1.2.2.1-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-palmax-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-penmount-1.1.0-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-rendition-4.1.3-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-s3-0.5.0-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-s3virge-1.9.1-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-savage-2.1.2-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-siliconmotion-1.4.1-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-sis-0.9.3-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-sisusb-0.8.1-4.1 xorg-x11-drv-spaceorb-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-summa-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-tdfx-1.3.0-2.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-trident-1.2.3-2.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-tseng-1.1.0-3.1 xorg-x11-drv-ur98-1.1.0-1.1 xorg-x11-drv-v4l-0.1.1-4 xorg-x11-drv-vesa-1.3.0-2.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-vga-4.1.0-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-via-0.2.1-7 xorg-x11-drv-vmmouse-12.4.0-2.1 xorg-x11-drv-vmware-10.14.1-1.fc7 xorg-x11-drv-void-1.1.0-3.1 xorg-x11-drv-voodoo-1.1.0-3.1 xorg-x11-filesystem-7.1-2.fc6 xorg-x11-fonts-100dpi-7.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-fonts-75dpi-7.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-fonts-base-7.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-fonts-ISO8859-1-100dpi-7.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-fonts-ISO8859-1-75dpi-7.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-fonts-misc-7.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-fonts-truetype-7.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-fonts-Type1-7.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-font-utils-7.1-2 xorg-x11-server-utils-7.1-5.fc7 xorg-x11-server-Xorg-1.2.0-3.fc7 xorg-x11-twm-1.0.1-3.1 xorg-x11-utils-7.1-3.fc7 xorg-x11-xauth-1.0.2-1.fc7 xorg-x11-xdm-1.1.3-1.fc7 xorg-x11-xfs-1.0.2-3.1 xorg-x11-xinit-1.0.2-15.fc7 xorg-x11-xkb-utils-1.0.2-3.fc7 xsri-2.1.0-10.fc6 xterm-223-2.fc7 yakuake-2.7.5-4.fc7 ypbind-1.19-7.fc7 yp-tools-2.9-0.1 yum-3.1.0-2.fc7 yum-metadata-parser-1.0.3-1.fc7 yum-updatesd-3.1.0-2.fc7 zip-2.31-1.2.2 zlib-1.2.3-4
I've installed kleansweep, kdmtheme, yakuake and katapult from FE :)
On Monday 08 January 2007 02:42pm, Rex Dieter wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Good times :) .
Folks are welcome to contribute, criticize, add-to.
One thing I've wanted to see for a long time is better packaging granularity of some apps in the core set of KDE packages. I don't use all the apps that I have on my system, but in some cases, the current packages require me to install several apps just to get the one or two I want.
On 1/8/07, Lamont Peterson lamont@gurulabs.com wrote:
On Monday 08 January 2007 02:42pm, Rex Dieter wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Good times :) .
Folks are welcome to contribute, criticize, add-to.
One thing I've wanted to see for a long time is better packaging granularity of some apps in the core set of KDE packages. I don't use all the apps that I have on my system, but in some cases, the current packages require me to install several apps just to get the one or two I want.
Fair suggestions - in my case however, I don't see this as a problem since every now and then I go about exploring my install finding new applications.
On 1/9/07, Lamont Peterson wrote:
One thing I've wanted to see for a long time is better packaging granularity of some apps in the core set of KDE packages. I don't use all the apps that I have on my system, but in some cases, the current packages require me to install several apps just to get the one or two I want.
This is something I would like to see as well :)
Chitlesh
Lamont Peterson wrote:
One thing I've wanted to see for a long time is better packaging granularity of some apps in the core set of KDE packages.
Which equates to much more work on the packagers' part (usually). Are you willing to step up to help implement this? (:
-- Rex
On Tuesday 09 January 2007 08:17am, Rex Dieter wrote:
Lamont Peterson wrote:
One thing I've wanted to see for a long time is better packaging granularity of some apps in the core set of KDE packages.
Which equates to much more work on the packagers' part (usually). Are you willing to step up to help implement this? (:
You're right, it does mean more work for packagers.
I can certainly help with some of the packaging. Feel free to contact me off-list.
Just to clarify, I'm not suggesting splitting every single KDE app into it's own package; some things should be broken up into smaller sub-packages and others shouldn't.
Lamont Peterson wrote:
Just to clarify, I'm not suggesting splitting every single KDE app into it's own package; some things should be broken up into smaller sub-packages and others shouldn't.
OK, I agree, in theory. Now, any concrete suggestions (with justifications)? (:
-- Rex
On 1/10/07, Rex Dieter wrote:
OK, I agree, in theory. Now, any concrete suggestions (with justifications)? (:
Or perhaps, those who are willing to split packages write up in a table on the wiki in order to know who is working on what.
Possibly or it may be a must, goes for a review afterwards.
Chitlesh
Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
On 1/10/07, Rex Dieter wrote:
OK, I agree, in theory. Now, any concrete suggestions (with justifications)? (:
Or perhaps, those who are willing to split packages write up in a table on the wiki in order to know who is working on what.
Don't care, though I'd rather try discussing things first, to avoid wasted effort.
-- Rex
On 1/10/07, Rex Dieter rdieter@math.unl.edu wrote:
OK, I agree, in theory. Now, any concrete suggestions (with justifications)? (:
How about: - kruler - kcolorchooser - kcoloredit - kiconedit from kdegraphics ?
These little apps are not useful for the norma joe neither for an admin.
Chitlesh
On 1/30/07, Chitlesh GOORAH chitlesh@fedoraproject.org wrote:
On 1/10/07, Rex Dieter rdieter@math.unl.edu wrote:
OK, I agree, in theory. Now, any concrete suggestions (with justifications)? (:
How about:
- kruler
- kcolorchooser
- kcoloredit
- kiconedit
from kdegraphics ?
These little apps are not useful for the norma joe neither for an admin.
Chitlesh
Hey....they are useful to me. KColorChooser for sure.
On Wed, 2007-01-31 at 06:08 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
On 1/10/07, Rex Dieter rdieter@math.unl.edu wrote:
OK, I agree, in theory. Now, any concrete suggestions (with justifications)? (:
How about:
- kruler
- kcolorchooser
- kcoloredit
- kiconedit
from kdegraphics ?
These little apps are not useful for the norma joe neither for an admin.
Chitlesh
I may be asking a stupid question, but considering the nature of the Fedora-KDE project (community driven) and the limited resource the project has at it's disposal, shouldn't the resources be spent on say, creating a better KDE environment Instead of just repacking the life out of KDE?
- Gilboa
On Wednesday 31 January 2007 07:08, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
How about:
- kruler
- kcolorchooser
- kcoloredit
- kiconedit
from kdegraphics ?
These little apps are not useful for the norma joe neither for an admin.
To a regular joe, maybe not. For an admin, definitely not. For a developer, yes. It will save 250k from a package. While at the same time lots of additional GNOME packages are added to the distribution. I think that cutting short the KDE packages will be just a waste. Dorin
On Mon, 2007-01-08 at 15:42 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Folks are welcome to contribute, criticize, add-to.
-- Rex
Hello Rex,
Package set (outside of the usual kde* set) Brainstorm ideas for package inclusion in spin. These need not be installed by default.
* System: kiosktool knetworkmanager Add kdebluetooth.
* non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
* kdm/login (Artwork) Will kdm get the same look and feel (read, branding) as the gdm counter-part?
- Gilboa
On Tue, Jan 09, 2007 at 11:06:46AM +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
- non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org
Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
Then we end up with 90% of GNOME in the KDE spin...
firefox and openoffice.org are not gnome apps. The corresponding gnome apps are epiphany and abiword for ooffice (to my knowledge).
-- Pat
On 1/9/07, Patrice Dumas pertusus@free.fr wrote:
On Tue, Jan 09, 2007 at 11:06:46AM +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
- non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org
Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
Then we end up with 90% of GNOME in the KDE spin...
firefox and openoffice.org are not gnome apps. The corresponding gnome apps are epiphany and abiword for ooffice (to my knowledge).
As far as I remember those pull in a lot of gnome applications. It would be great if the KDE spin had the firefox patch to get it to use the KDE file browser.
-- Pat
-- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Arthur Pemberton <pemboa <at> gmail.com> writes:
As far as I remember those pull in a lot of gnome applications. It would be great if the KDE spin had the firefox patch to get it to use the KDE file browser.
If that requires building a completely separate Firefox for the KDE spin, it's probably not going to happen.
Currently, not even openoffice.org-kde is being built and that could be done as a separate subpackage (containing only the KDE integration bits, and requiring the main package), unless this has regressed in OO.o 2. (It used to be a separate package in OO.o 1.) It probably requires changes to the main executables though, so it can't be built like some of the plugins currently in Extras are (though I'd love to be proven wrong there ;-) ).
Kevin Kofler
On Tuesday 09 January 2007 01:03pm, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Arthur Pemberton <pemboa <at> gmail.com> writes:
As far as I remember those pull in a lot of gnome applications. It would be great if the KDE spin had the firefox patch to get it to use the KDE file browser.
If that requires building a completely separate Firefox for the KDE spin, it's probably not going to happen.
Currently, not even openoffice.org-kde is being built and that could be done as a separate subpackage (containing only the KDE integration bits, and requiring the main package), unless this has regressed in OO.o 2. (It used to be a separate package in OO.o 1.) It probably requires changes to the main executables though, so it can't be built like some of the plugins currently in Extras are (though I'd love to be proven wrong there ;-) ).
SUSE is building the -kde sub-package for OpenOffice 2. It's in openSUSE 10.2 and installed by default (if you select KDE for the desktop). I think F7 should ship it, too.
tir, 09.01.2007 kl. 13.56 -0600, skrev Arthur Pemberton:
On 1/9/07, Patrice Dumas pertusus@free.fr wrote:
On Tue, Jan 09, 2007 at 11:06:46AM +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
- non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org
Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
Then we end up with 90% of GNOME in the KDE spin...
firefox and openoffice.org are not gnome apps. The corresponding gnome apps are epiphany and abiword for ooffice (to my knowledge).
As far as I remember those pull in a lot of gnome applications. It would be great if the KDE spin had the firefox patch to get it to use the KDE file browser.
Here's the list of glib/gtk/gnome things that are listed when running rpm -q --requires firefox:
libORBit-2.so.0 libart_lgpl_2.so.2 libatk-1.0.so.0 libbonobo-2.so.0 libbonobo-activation.so.4 libbonoboui-2.so.0 libglib-2.0.so.0 libgmodule-2.0.so.0 libgnome-2.so.0 libgnome-keyring.so.0 libgnomecanvas-2.so.0 libgnomeui-2.so.0 libgnomevfs-2.so.0 libgobject-2.0.so.0 libgthread-2.0.so.0 libgtk-x11-2.0.so.0 libpango-1.0.so.0 libpangocairo-1.0.so.0 libpangoft2-1.0.so.0 libpangoxft-1.0.so.0
evolution drags in quite a few other libraries though.
Cheers Kjartan
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 11:06 +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
- non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org
Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
Then we end up with 90% of GNOME in the KDE spin...
Out of the list above only evolution is "GNOME". (And given the its history, even evolution isn't really a GNOME application.) In the GNOME world Epiphany is the browser and Abiword/Gnumeric is the office package.
Hopefully by the time KDE 4/KOffice 2.0 are released, koffice/kmail/konq will be able to replace OO/Evo/firefox.
- Gilboa
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
Out of the list above only evolution is "GNOME". (And given the its history, even evolution isn't really a GNOME application.) In the GNOME world Epiphany is the browser and Abiword/Gnumeric is the office package.
I know. I was referring to Evolution alone drawing in most of GNOME as dependencies. Now I personally don't have a problem with having to install GNOME libraries (I install whatever (appropriately licensed) libraries programs I want to use or even just try out require), but I'm not convinced Evolution is a good reason to include them. (In fact, it seems to be the most hated default app in Fedora judging from the comments on the mailing lists, some GNOME users are looking for an alternative too, some even switched to Kontact or KMail.)
Hopefully by the time KDE 4/KOffice 2.0 are released, koffice/kmail/konq will be able to replace OO/Evo/firefox.
I use KMail and Konqueror (as browser - I use Krusader as my file manager) all the time, they work fine for me.
For the office suite, I don't need it often, so I could probably do with KOffice, but I do see the difference in features, so I do think OO.o is nice to have on the KDE spin (though it would be nice if the KDE integration (KDE NWF, KDE file dialogs) was available again, it had been for a moment in late OO.o 1 times and then got dropped again with OO.o 2).
Kevin Kofler
On 1/9/07, Kevin Kofler wrote:
I know. I was referring to Evolution alone drawing in most of GNOME as dependencies. Now I personally don't have a problem with having to install GNOME libraries (I install whatever (appropriately licensed) libraries programs I want to use or even just try out require), but I'm not convinced Evolution is a good reason to include them. (In fact, it seems to be the most hated default app in Fedora judging from the comments on the mailing lists, some GNOME users are looking for an alternative too, some even switched to Kontact or KMail.)
I'll back the idea for not including evolution in KDE spin. Hmm having evolution on a kde spin isn't really a kde spin. Kontact is already among core kde packages why should the heck be a replacement for that ? at least evolution is being supplied on the repositories. As far are firefox and openoffice are concerned, I'm ok with them, but not evolution.
example: Kontact communicates very well with kwallet for password storage. Now if we include evolution in the kde spin, should we be working to provide such feature for evolution?
Chitlesh
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 18:23 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
On 1/9/07, Kevin Kofler wrote:
I know. I was referring to Evolution alone drawing in most of GNOME as dependencies. Now I personally don't have a problem with having to install GNOME libraries (I install whatever (appropriately licensed) libraries programs I want to use or even just try out require), but I'm not convinced Evolution is a good reason to include them. (In fact, it seems to be the most hated default app in Fedora judging from the comments on the mailing lists, some GNOME users are looking for an alternative too, some even switched to Kontact or KMail.)
I'll back the idea for not including evolution in KDE spin. Hmm having evolution on a kde spin isn't really a kde spin. Kontact is already among core kde packages why should the heck be a replacement for that ? at least evolution is being supplied on the repositories. As far are firefox and openoffice are concerned, I'm ok with them, but not evolution.
example: Kontact communicates very well with kwallet for password storage. Now if we include evolution in the kde spin, should we be working to provide such feature for evolution?
Chitlesh
Having evolution in the KDE spin doesn't mean that it has to be the default group-ware client or even installed by default.
As weird as it sounds, I want it in -because- it is so d*mn big. According to the Fedora ML usage stats, Evo holds the #1 spot - making it reasonable to guess that many of them are KDE users. Asking them to download 100s of MB during the installation is a mistake.
If/when kmail gets a better groupware/exchange integration, it'll be possible to drop evolution.
- Gilboa
On 1/9/07, Gilboa Davara gilboad@gmail.com wrote:
Asking them to download 100s of MB during the installation is a mistake.
Then they will have to download the 100s of MB through downloads! In the end, it is the same thing.
I prefer to see some development tools or even engineering/scientific kde tools instead.
Chitlesh
On 1/9/07, Chitlesh GOORAH chitlesh@fedoraproject.org wrote:
On 1/9/07, Gilboa Davara gilboad@gmail.com wrote:
Asking them to download 100s of MB during the installation is a mistake.
Then they will have to download the 100s of MB through downloads! In the end, it is the same thing.
Downloading hundreds of different files is much slower than downloading one file of the same size.
Also, the initial spin is likely (?) to be downloaded via bittorrent, which is not an option for yum when it needs individual packages.
A single iso download can also feed multiple PCs (up to 5 in my case), which is far more efficient than downloading the same hundreds of files several times over.
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 17:49 -0500, Andrew Parker wrote:
On 1/9/07, Chitlesh GOORAH chitlesh@fedoraproject.org wrote:
On 1/9/07, Gilboa Davara gilboad@gmail.com wrote:
Asking them to download 100s of MB during the installation is a mistake.
Then they will have to download the 100s of MB through downloads! In the end, it is the same thing.
Downloading hundreds of different files is much slower than downloading one file of the same size.
Only if having a very reliable and fast connection. With low bandwidth or unreliable connections, the opposite applies.
Also, the initial spin is likely (?) to be downloaded via bittorrent, which is not an option for yum when it needs individual packages.
A single iso download can also feed multiple PCs (up to 5 in my case), which is far more efficient than downloading the same hundreds of files several times over.
With a couple tricks applied (sharing yum caches over a network) yum can do the same.
Ralf
On 1/10/07, Ralf Corsepius rc040203@freenet.de wrote:
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 17:49 -0500, Andrew Parker wrote:
On 1/9/07, Chitlesh GOORAH chitlesh@fedoraproject.org wrote:
On 1/9/07, Gilboa Davara gilboad@gmail.com wrote:
Asking them to download 100s of MB during the installation is a mistake.
Then they will have to download the 100s of MB through downloads! In the end, it is the same thing.
Downloading hundreds of different files is much slower than downloading one file of the same size.
Only if having a very reliable and fast connection. With low bandwidth or unreliable connections, the opposite applies.
Also, the initial spin is likely (?) to be downloaded via bittorrent, which is not an option for yum when it needs individual packages.
A single iso download can also feed multiple PCs (up to 5 in my case), which is far more efficient than downloading the same hundreds of files several times over.
With a couple tricks applied (sharing yum caches over a network) yum can do the same.
well, i did think about setting up squid to do this job, but..
1. yum uses mirrors. not knowing squid that much, i don't know if it can be convinced to consider different hosts and different paths to be the same? 2. not all of my pcs that i install on are local to each other, so wouldn't be able to benefit from this.
besides, it is still the case that downloading hundreds of different files is much slower than downloading one file of the same size.
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 20:06 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
On 1/9/07, Gilboa Davara gilboad@gmail.com wrote:
Asking them to download 100s of MB during the installation is a mistake.
Then they will have to download the 100s of MB through downloads! In the end, it is the same thing.
-Far- from being the same thing. A. Some people get/buy the FC ISO and never use it on-line. Heck, I've worked in places that (for security reasons) never Internet connection. What-you-have-on-the-ISO-is-what-you-get. B. A single ISO can be duplicated over and over again. I can't share a yum-cache with my friend. C. Single-file FTP/HTTP/BT downloads are faster and more reliable then yum. BT handles notoriously bad TCP connections much better then FTP/HTTP (...and as a result, yum)
I prefer to see some development tools or even engineering/scientific kde tools instead.
A. I'm not sure this is mutually exclusive. B. Even if it is, I'd venture and guess the given this ML usage statistics, more people use Evolution over KDE then each of these engineering/scientific tools. C. ... And even if I'm wrong: 1. These tools tend to be (much) smaller - much better suited for yum download - even on modem link. 2. I'd guess that if you require these tools, you ether use them @work (where you have broadband link) or at home (where you have a broadband link).
- Gilboa
On Wednesday 10 January 2007 05:41am, Gilboa Davara wrote:
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 20:06 +0100, Chitlesh GOORAH wrote:
On 1/9/07, Gilboa Davara gilboad@gmail.com wrote:
Asking them to download 100s of MB during the installation is a mistake.
Then they will have to download the 100s of MB through downloads! In the end, it is the same thing.
-Far- from being the same thing. A. Some people get/buy the FC ISO and never use it on-line. Heck, I've worked in places that (for security reasons) never Internet connection. What-you-have-on-the-ISO-is-what-you-get. B. A single ISO can be duplicated over and over again. I can't share a yum-cache with my friend.
Yes you can, just copy /var/cache/yum/ to a USB keychain drive (or SD card, or ...) or burn it to a disc. However, because the cache will change almost daily, this could get tedious.
Personally, I have local mirrors on my home file server of the updates repos for each release I have running. Every 6 hours, a cron job runs a script which syncs me up and then runs createrepo on my copy (that way, it always works regardless of the sync status of the mirror I'm pulling from). My machines all use it.
I've also created a "mirrorlist" script on a web server (PHP) for myself that will give me just my local mirror when within my network, and get the current mirrorlist to pass back when outside of my network. I then point my notebooks' updates repo config to that mirrorlist. The next step is to extend this to also work with the local mirror on the network at my office when I'm there.
I haven't tried to do installs with updates, yet, but I'm looking forward to doing it. I expect that I will always use my local mirror.
C. Single-file FTP/HTTP/BT downloads are faster and more reliable then yum. BT handles notoriously bad TCP connections much better then FTP/HTTP (...and as a result, yum)
Yes. Still, I run yum simply because it's easier. Local mirrors also help.
[snip]
On 1/10/07, Lamont Peterson lamont@gurulabs.com wrote:
Yes you can, just copy /var/cache/yum/ to a USB keychain drive (or SD card, or ...) or burn it to a disc. However, because the cache will change almost daily, this could get tedious.
Maybe its just my setups, but my /var/cache/yum wouldn't be worth sharing. Comparing the contents of the directory either side of an install resulted in no change. Is a copy of the package supposed to be in there?
On Thursday 11 January 2007 02:50am, Andrew Parker wrote:
On 1/10/07, Lamont Peterson lamont@gurulabs.com wrote:
Yes you can, just copy /var/cache/yum/ to a USB keychain drive (or SD card, or ...) or burn it to a disc. However, because the cache will change almost daily, this could get tedious.
Maybe its just my setups, but my /var/cache/yum wouldn't be worth sharing. Comparing the contents of the directory either side of an install resulted in no change. Is a copy of the package supposed to be in there?
You need to edit /etc/yum.conf and change keepcache to 1. This defaulted to 0 (i.e., delete the package files after they're installed) as of FC5, IIRC.
On 1/11/07, Lamont Peterson lamont@gurulabs.com wrote:
You need to edit /etc/yum.conf and change keepcache to 1. This defaulted to 0 (i.e., delete the package files after they're installed) as of FC5, IIRC.
bingo! thanks.
On Thu, 2007-01-11 at 04:50 -0500, Andrew Parker wrote:
On 1/10/07, Lamont Peterson lamont@gurulabs.com wrote:
Yes you can, just copy /var/cache/yum/ to a USB keychain drive (or SD card, or ...) or burn it to a disc. However, because the cache will change almost daily, this could get tedious.
Maybe its just my setups, but my /var/cache/yum wouldn't be worth sharing. Comparing the contents of the directory either side of an install resulted in no change. Is a copy of the package supposed to be in there?
Make sure you have keepcache=1 in your /etc/yum.conf
David
On Tuesday 09 January 2007 20:20, Gilboa Davara wrote:
Having evolution in the KDE spin doesn't mean that it has to be the default group-ware client or even installed by default. As weird as it sounds, I want it in -because- it is so d*mn big. According to the Fedora ML usage stats, Evo holds the #1 spot - making it reasonable to guess that many of them are KDE users. Asking them to download 100s of MB during the installation is a mistake.
Since that is what the default is, that is what they use. I'm on Fedora, I never used GNOME because I didn't like it (but I tried it everytime). And I am quite happy with what KDE has to offer. Make kontact the default, and you'll have a plethora of kontact users. Or better, make evolution an option, but don't put it in the default settings. After all, I have to check everytime that mc should be put in, and as much as I dislike that (the fact that mc is not default) I got used to it. Also, perhaps the ones that want a KDE-only distro might not like the GNOME apps after all? Dorin
On 1/9/07, Dorin Lazar wrote:
Also, perhaps the ones that want a KDE-only distro might not like the GNOME apps after all?
It's not a question of dislikes, but how much room could we spent on other non-kde apps on the iso image.
Chitlesh
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 21:08 +0200, Dorin Lazar wrote:
Since that is what the default is, that is what they use.
I object to you line of thinking. (Start by the "they") People who use Linux are usually people that could use another OS that came with their machine by default (Windows) and choose otherwise. More-ever, the people that will -choose- the Fedora-KDE spin, already decided to ignore the default (Desktop spin) - so why are you assuming that "they" are a mindless herd that will use the default - no matter what the default is.
I'm on Fedora, I never used GNOME because I didn't like it (but I tried it everytime). And I am quite happy with what KDE has to offer. Make kontact the default, and you'll have a plethora of kontact users.
No objections here. Heck, don't even install it by default. I just want the Evo dep-chain on the ISO - nothing else.
- Gilboa
On Wednesday 10 January 2007 04:19am, Gilboa Davara wrote:
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 21:08 +0200, Dorin Lazar wrote:
Since that is what the default is, that is what they use.
I object to you line of thinking. (Start by the "they") People who use Linux are usually people that could use another OS that came with their machine by default (Windows) and choose otherwise. More-ever, the people that will -choose- the Fedora-KDE spin, already decided to ignore the default (Desktop spin) - so why are you assuming that "they" are a mindless herd that will use the default - no matter what the default is.
For the most part, I think that you are right. However, I think that many in this category still start out with the "default" installed app for a given task. Sure, they're going to explore other available choices, but in most cases, human beings stick with what is more familiar/comfortable to them. If they get too busy early on to take the time to look at other apps, then they may (often do?) end up being comfortable enough with the default (whatever that is) to just go with it or to actually prefer it, even if they would really be better served by an alternate.
I'm on Fedora, I never used GNOME because I didn't like it (but I tried it everytime). And I am quite happy with what KDE has to offer. Make kontact the default, and you'll have a plethora of kontact users.
No objections here. Heck, don't even install it by default. I just want the Evo dep-chain on the ISO - nothing else.
I don't want it on the ISO for me to use. Although I'll probably not install Evolution, if I do I would want the updated release and so would be downloading it anyway.
But, I do want Evolution on the KDE spin for all the other people I would had a disc(s) to. I want them to have the choice. However, if it's not there, they can always download it just like I would (or I could give them the packages, etc.).
I also think that the point several have put forward that there are a percentage of users (small, yes, but they are there) who will not have access to the repos and will, therefore, only have whatever is on the disc(s). For those people, having the choices would be not just a good thing, but perhaps a necessity.
However, since it's (going to be) not that had to create additional spins, why not let those users take the KDE spin and add to it?
Or how about if we (i.e. the Fedora Community) also create an "Everything" spin? Every single package in the distribution. It would be a lot of CDs and could be more than one single-layer DVD. We should probably also create a dual-layer DVD ISO for such a massive spin. I think that would be a good option to offer for many people's needs. It could also be used to let them create their own custom spins from the whole Fedora catalog of available packages.
Gilboa Davara wrote:
Package set (outside of the usual kde* set) Brainstorm ideas for package inclusion in spin. These need not be installed by default.
- System: kiosktool knetworkmanager
Add kdebluetooth.
Not in Fedora (yet), pending review.
- non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org
Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
/me shudders, but I think I have to agree.
- kdm/login (Artwork)
Will kdm get the same look and feel (read, branding) as the gdm counter-part?
Not necessarily, but we'd want something close to the standard F7 branding/artwork look-n-feel.
-- Rex
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 09:18 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote:
Gilboa Davara wrote:
[snip]
- non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org
Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
/me shudders, but I think I have to agree.
No fear! So what if you have to include half of GNOME, mono, and 250 other packages just to get it working... :)
As much as I dislike the-bloat-ware-known-as-evo, it's the best outlook (*spit) replacement in the OSS world. Hopefully, kmail will get exchange integration and -decent- * keyboard navigation in KDE4.
- Gilboa * I know... I know... it's customizable. But I always lose patience within 25 minutes of trying to get the *** thing to work like evo/thunderbird/mozilla/outlook/etc.
On 1/9/07, Gilboa Davara gilboad@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 09:18 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote:
Gilboa Davara wrote:
[snip]
- non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org
Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
/me shudders, but I think I have to agree.
No fear! So what if you have to include half of GNOME, mono, and 250 other packages just to get it working... :)
But what would that do to the install media size?
As much as I dislike the-bloat-ware-known-as-evo, it's the best outlook (*spit) replacement in the OSS world. Hopefully, kmail will get exchange integration and -decent- * keyboard navigation in KDE4.
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 13:58 -0600, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
On 1/9/07, Gilboa Davara gilboad@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 09:18 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote:
Gilboa Davara wrote:
[snip]
- non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org
Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
/me shudders, but I think I have to agree.
No fear! So what if you have to include half of GNOME, mono, and 250 other packages just to get it working... :)
But what would that do to the install media size?
I'm guessing here., but the rpm --requires list seems to suggest that at least half of the dependencies are already added by firefox. Notable exceptions are gnome-print and gnome-pilot. (Which are not that big) *
- Gilboa
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 15:17 +0200, Gilboa Davara wrote:
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 13:58 -0600, Arthur Pemberton wrote:
On 1/9/07, Gilboa Davara gilboad@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, 2007-01-09 at 09:18 -0600, Rex Dieter wrote:
Gilboa Davara wrote:
[snip]
- non-kde pkgs: firefox, openoffice.org
Add evolution. (Required if you need good exchange integration)
/me shudders, but I think I have to agree.
No fear! So what if you have to include half of GNOME, mono, and 250 other packages just to get it working... :)
But what would that do to the install media size?
I'm guessing here., but the rpm --requires list seems to suggest that at least half of the dependencies are already added by firefox. Notable exceptions are gnome-print and gnome-pilot. (Which are not that big) *
evolution's gnome-pilot dependency could be made optional; I just filed bug 222109 about this.
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 15:43 +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
I'm guessing here., but the rpm --requires list seems to suggest that at least half of the dependencies are already added by firefox.
Then let's zap Firefox too, that's what Konqueror is for.
Kevin Kofler
Sigh. This is a waste of time.
- Gilboa
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Gilboa Davara wrote:
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 15:43 +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
I'm guessing here., but the rpm --requires list seems to suggest that at least half of the dependencies are already added by firefox.
Then let's zap Firefox too, that's what Konqueror is for.
Kevin Kofler
Sigh. This is a waste of time.
Was it just last week that we had the 'install everything' people here? Now we have the 'install nothing' people. ;-)
- --
David
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 08:05 -0800, David Boles wrote:
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Gilboa Davara wrote:
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 15:43 +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
I'm guessing here., but the rpm --requires list seems to suggest that at least half of the dependencies are already added by firefox.
Then let's zap Firefox too, that's what Konqueror is for.
Kevin Kofler
Sigh. This is a waste of time.
Was it just last week that we had the 'install everything' people here? Now we have the 'install nothing' people. ;-)
Next week we are having the Fedora/BSD, FedoraSource, and FedoraOnAFloppy groups. Bring fire-extinguishers.
- Gilboa
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Gilboa Davara wrote:
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 08:05 -0800, David Boles wrote:
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Gilboa Davara wrote:
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 15:43 +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
I'm guessing here., but the rpm --requires list seems to suggest that at least half of the dependencies are already added by firefox.
Then let's zap Firefox too, that's what Konqueror is for.
Kevin Kofler
Sigh. This is a waste of time.
Was it just last week that we had the 'install everything' people here? Now we have the 'install nothing' people. ;-)
Next week we are having the Fedora/BSD, FedoraSource, and FedoraOnAFloppy groups. Bring fire-extinguishers.
Really? That could get interesting. 8-)
Then long. Then boring. Thank goodness for filters.
- --
David
"DB" == David Boles dgboles@gmail.com writes:
DB> Was it just last week that we had the 'install everything' people DB> here? Now we have the 'install nothing' people. ;-)
Did anyone call?
I'm just hoping that there'll be a minimal spin or premade kickstart file or something. All I need is enough to run yum -- or at least rpm -i http://..../yum-... (So basic ethernet IPv4 networking and rpm)
/Benny
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Benny Amorsen wrote:
"DB" == David Boles dgboles@gmail.com writes:
DB> Was it just last week that we had the 'install everything' people DB> here? Now we have the 'install nothing' people. ;-)
Did anyone call?
I'm just hoping that there'll be a minimal spin or premade kickstart file or something. All I need is enough to run yum -- or at least rpm -i http://..../yum-... (So basic ethernet IPv4 networking and rpm)
Try the boot.iso. Only 7.9 Megs. It would fit on a mini-CD with room to spare.
- --
David
On Wed, Jan 10, 2007 at 11:37:57AM -0800, David Boles wrote:
DB> Was it just last week that we had the 'install everything' people DB> here? Now we have the 'install nothing' people. ;-) Did anyone call? I'm just hoping that there'll be a minimal spin or premade kickstart file or something. All I need is enough to run yum -- or at least rpm -i http://..../yum-... (So basic ethernet IPv4 networking and rpm)
Try the boot.iso. Only 7.9 Megs. It would fit on a mini-CD with room to spare.
It's still nice to then have that install CD put a very minimal set of packages on the system, which you can then add to as needed.
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 18:52 +0100, Benny Amorsen wrote:
"DB" == David Boles dgboles@gmail.com writes:
DB> Was it just last week that we had the 'install everything' people DB> here? Now we have the 'install nothing' people. ;-)
Did anyone call?
I'm just hoping that there'll be a minimal spin or premade kickstart file or something. All I need is enough to run yum -- or at least rpm -i http://..../yum-... (So basic ethernet IPv4 networking and rpm)
I am looking at reducing the minimal install (@core + @base) for the Fedora Server spin, but that shouldn't stop anybody from posting their suggestions and experiences reducing the install.
David
2:33pm David Lutterkort said:
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 18:52 +0100, Benny Amorsen wrote:
> "DB" == David Boles dgboles@gmail.com writes:
DB> Was it just last week that we had the 'install everything' people DB> here? Now we have the 'install nothing' people. ;-)
Did anyone call?
I'm just hoping that there'll be a minimal spin or premade kickstart file or something. All I need is enough to run yum -- or at least rpm -i http://..../yum-... (So basic ethernet IPv4 networking and rpm)
I am looking at reducing the minimal install (@core + @base) for the Fedora Server spin, but that shouldn't stop anybody from posting their suggestions and experiences reducing the install.
Here's a good starting point for fc6 kick.
%packages -@dial-up -@java
I can't remember exactly, but the installed footprint gets significantly smaller. If you can live without the above.
Beyond that, it's a matter of style/opinion. Here's just some example hunklets:
# irrelevant hardware -ccid -coolkey.i386 -coolkey.x86_64 -bluez-libs -bluez-pin -bluez-utils -irda-utils -pcmciautils # the Xeons in this ProLiant don't know a damn thing about low power -cpuspeed
# unwanted services -NetworkManager -gpm.i386 -gpm.x86_64 -nfs-utils -portmap -yp-tools -ypbind
# useless things that drag in other deps -firstboot-tui -system-config-network-tui -system-config-securitylevel-tui
It goes on and on...and I've successfully removed upon install *all* i386 packages on an x86_64 system without screwing up the rpm verify database. Of course your mileage may vary. Nobody wants to see things like nfs/nis/etc. go away. Just if they aren't desired initially.
../C
On 10 Jan 2007 18:52:00 +0100, Benny Amorsen benny+usenet@amorsen.dk wrote:
"DB" == David Boles dgboles@gmail.com writes:
DB> Was it just last week that we had the 'install everything' people DB> here? Now we have the 'install nothing' people. ;-)
Did anyone call?
I'm just hoping that there'll be a minimal spin or premade kickstart file or something. All I need is enough to run yum -- or at least rpm -i http://..../yum-... (So basic ethernet IPv4 networking and rpm)
/Benny
I don't mean to hijack this thread, but along the line of a minimum install, considering that after installing FC, generally, near half the packages need updating due to feature and devel freezes, how about a bare minimum spin....just enough to get to the internet, hit fedorasolved.org (via browser) to check for important messages/notices. Then do a yum/piruit update/install. Purely from my gut feeling, lacking any scienntific checking, it seems that one may actually use less bandwidth to get a complete (customized) desktop or solution.
Call it Fedora Base
On Wednesday 10 January 2007 09:43, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
I'm guessing here., but the rpm --requires list seems to suggest that at least half of the dependencies are already added by firefox.
Then let's zap Firefox too, that's what Konqueror is for.
While i use konq for pretty much all my browsing i have times i need to use firefox. I really think we need both.
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 15:43 +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
I'm guessing here., but the rpm --requires list seems to suggest that at least half of the dependencies are already added by firefox.
Then let's zap Firefox too, that's what Konqueror is for.
Kevin Kofler
Forgot to add the "why-did-I-sigh" part.
You don't want to remove Firefox because Konq is the better tool - you want to remove Konq because it doesn't fit your purist view of KDE-only distribution. As such, I see little use in trying to explain my point - I doubt that you would actually take the time to listen.
- Gilboa
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
You don't want to remove Firefox because Konq is the better tool - you want to remove [Firefox]* because it doesn't fit your purist view of KDE-only distribution.
Not really (though I see how you could get that impression). I use some non-KDE apps daily, X-Chat for example. (I like its C plugin interface, I have written a few script-like plugins in C for X-Chat. Most users will probably be happy with Konversation though, if they even use IRC at all.) I doubt the usefulness of Firefox in particular (over Konqueror) though (and the usefulness of Evolution even more, considering that I never use it whereas I use KMail all the time, and that AFAICS it gets more flames than any other application which ships with Fedora). Personally, I'd rather have X-Chat available than Firefox or Evolution, but that is my very biased personal preference.
As for generally useful non-KDE apps (not just the one I happen to use the most ;-) ), I think OO.o and GIMP qualify, but IMHO not Firefox and definitely not Evolution. Ekiga might also be interesting, though that probably drags in several GNOME libs too.
* I guess that's what you meant because otherwise your sentence makes no sense. ;-)
Kevin Kofler
On Wed, 2007-01-10 at 16:57 +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Gilboa Davara <gilboad <at> gmail.com> writes:
You don't want to remove Firefox because Konq is the better tool - you want to remove [Firefox]* because it doesn't fit your purist view of KDE-only distribution.
Not really (though I see how you could get that impression). I use some non-KDE apps daily, X-Chat for example. (I like its C plugin interface, I have written a few script-like plugins in C for X-Chat. Most users will probably be happy with Konversation though, if they even use IRC at all.) I doubt the usefulness of Firefox in particular (over Konqueror) though (and the usefulness of Evolution even more, considering that I never use it whereas I use KMail all the time, and that AFAICS it gets more flames than any other application which ships with Fedora). Personally, I'd rather have X-Chat available than Firefox or Evolution, but that is my very biased personal preference.
As for generally useful non-KDE apps (not just the one I happen to use the most ;-) ), I think OO.o and GIMP qualify, but IMHO not Firefox and definitely not Evolution. Ekiga might also be interesting, though that probably drags in several GNOME libs too.
- I guess that's what you meant because otherwise your sentence makes no
sense. ;-)
Kevin Kofler
Guess I jumped the gun. My mistake, I apologize. I seem to be suffering from a mild case of sleep deprivation which makes a bit jumpy.
Firefox is not a leanest/cleanest product - no arguments there. (Hopefully FF 3.0 will be a major improvement when it comes to bloat) But for now, firefox has 3 major advantages: A. Extensions. B. Better site compatibility. C. ... Extensions.
A well configured (and extended) FF 1.5 runs circles around Konq/Opera/IE7. I'm not saying the Konq doesn't work for you - or that Firefox should be the default browser. I am saying the removing it from the ISO is a big mistake.
- Gilboa
On Monday 08 January 2007 16:42, Rex Dieter wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Folks are welcome to contribute, criticize, add-to.
-- Rex
1st - Great!!! Thank you.
I assume that one can still do things like yum install evolution with the kde spin ?
2nd - firefox should probably be included or easy to yum install - its the de facto standard.
3rd - whilst I use kmail (kontact) and mostly like it I have some reservations - i am using it - almost exclusively - but:
(a) it crashes (segv) a lot (imap) - bugs happen but response to fix things like this is very slow (bug reported july 2006 bug #128593) - this response to fix bugs worries me - its still in the same state. In fact, the only comments are to mark other bugs as dups - ie zero (zarro??) progress in fixing this critical bug ... and I think this may not be abnormal.
(b) it cannot reply to html formatted mail without destroying the mail. In practice this makes it very hard to use in the corporate world. This has been an open request since err 2004 (bug #86423) - html is a fact of life - kmail is the only graphical MUA which cannot handle html. Even outlook does this right!
So I somewhat reluctantly suggest evolution be added or easy to yum install for practical reasons - this may drag in some gnome libraries which is fine in my (obviously personal and biased) view. As long as folks can just install this anyway it probably doesn't matter. Evo is far from perfect too but ...
Thanks again ...
gene/
On Monday 08 January 2007 16:42, Rex Dieter wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Folks are welcome to contribute, criticize, add-to.
-- Rex
My take is to make it KDE only as much as possible. Let's make it so that people don't need non-KDE versions if possible. People can install anything else they want later. With the pace of updates they'll need to download new versions of basically everything at some point anyway.
On Monday 08 January 2007 16:42, Rex Dieter wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
Folks are welcome to contribute, criticize, add-to.
-- Rex
I think openoffice is also kinda important - but may be one of those if you want it, yum install it kinda things.
gene
On Mon, Jan 08, 2007 at 03:42:19PM -0600, Rex Dieter wrote:
OK, I've slapped down a quick-n-dirty laundry list of items off the top of my head to get started on the F7 KDE spin: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/FeatureFedoraKDE
What about putting on the iso everything in comps which is in kde-desktop and the tools in kde-software-development (ie exclude the -devel packages)?
-- Pat
Patrice Dumas <pertusus <at> free.fr> writes:
What about putting on the iso everything in comps which is in kde-desktop and the tools in kde-software-development (ie exclude the -devel packages)?
"exclude the -devel packages"? Are you serious? I'd much rather have the KDE -devel packages on the ISO(s) than Evolution or Firefox!
Kevin Kofler
On Thu, 2007-01-11 at 10:54 +0000, Kevin Kofler wrote:
Patrice Dumas <pertusus <at> free.fr> writes:
What about putting on the iso everything in comps which is in kde-desktop and the tools in kde-software-development (ie exclude the -devel packages)?
"exclude the -devel packages"? Are you serious? I'd much rather have the KDE -devel packages on the ISO(s) than Evolution or Firefox!
Kevin Kofler
What about doing support ISO(s) for the spin? For example, you might have kde-desktop and kde-software-development, (etc, etc) in "F7 KDE CD 1: Desktop". Then, you might have "F7 KDE CD 2: Extra Applications" for firefox, evolution, etc. Finally, you might have "F7 KDE CD 3: Development Libraries" with all the -devel packages.
CD 3 doesn't need to depend on anything in CD 2, so you'd only need all three CDs if you want to install the extra applications AND the -devel packages.
I don't know what it would take to make this work, but IIRC, early RedHat distributions used to do something like this (or maybe it was just having SRPMS on different CDs).
Jonathan