education November 2008

education@lists.fedoraproject.org

3 participants
5 discussions

Re: [IAEP] Announcing Fedora Sugar Spin!
by Greg DeKoenigsberg 12 Nov '08

12 Nov '08

Thanks for the detailed analysis, Morgan. Much appreciated. --g On Wed, 12 Nov 2008, Morgan Collett wrote: > On Wed, Nov 12, 2008 at 18:02, Greg Dekoenigsberg <gdk(a)redhat.com> wrote: >> >> On Wed, 12 Nov 2008, Bill Kerr wrote: >> >>> Meaning what, exactly? Can you be more specific? >>> >>> Well, it's meant to be possible for collaboration to work out of the box. >>> This did not happen with Wolfgang's Live CD converted to USB keys. >>> >>> Someone reported earlier on this list that collaboration did work from >>> USB keys on a Ubuntu network >>> >>> from morgan collett: "Link local presence should "just work", but I've >>> never used the LiveCD images." >>> >>> At any rate Morgan asked us for some files and after they were sent >>> reported back: >>> >>> from morgan collett: >>> "Thanks for the logs. presenceservice.log shows that salut >>> (LinkLocalPlugin) starts up successfully but doesn't detect anyone on >>> the local network. gabble (ServerPlugin) repeatedly attempts to >>> connect to a jabber server but fails - nevertheless salut is running." >>> >>> After this one of my students built a jabber server and we could do >>> collaboration through that >>> >>> I was hoping that with the new Fedora USB key we could do collaboration >>> out of the box, meaning without using the jabber server >>> >>> All I tested with the new Fedora USB key was trying to connect through >>> Chat but that didn't work >>> >>> Let me know if you want more information or diagnostic files again - I can >>> look up the details or ask joel for help if needed - just tell me exactly >>> the information you need >>> >>> a bit more detail of the history here: >>> http://xo-whs.wikispaces.com/connectivity >> >> Ah, right. >> >> So what we have is a complex policy issue, but it boils down to this: >> >> With whom should a new Sugar user be "collaborating" by default? >> >> Many options here. Machines on the local mesh subnet? Should there be a >> default jabberd server? Should there be discoverability of all jabberd >> servers in the world? > > A quick explanation about the built-in policy of > sugar-presence-service: On startup, telepathy-salut is started for > link local presence and collaboration (avahi etc). If network manager > reports a valid IP address, then telepathy-gabble is started to try > and connect to the configured jabber server. Until such time as gabble > connects successfully, salut continues to be the presence mechanism. > When gabble connects, salut is stopped and presence is done via the > jabber server. > > That policy is in the code base and is not configurable without modifying code. > > OLPC XO releases ship with no jabber server configured (and in the > past, with a non-existant jabber server like ship2.jabber.laptop.org) > since our ejabberd setup falls over with more than about 150 people on > the server. (That is a more complex discussion which we have had > several times - ask me if you want the explanation. A 9.1.0 feature > should improve that.) > > Discoverability of jabber servers is unfortunately a good way to kill > them all, with the above limitation. Servers listed on > http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Community_Jabber_Servers are regularly down > for long periods because of this. > > With Sugar 0.82 it is easy to set a jabber server in the control > panel, but it should only be done by informed decision: Jabber servers > should only be run for specific communities, like an XO community in a > specific city, or a for a specific school, etc. We do not have an > access control mechanism to restrict that, but when people go "Oh > cool, let me try that one" at random then it denies service to the > intended users of the server. > > Debian Lenny and Ubuntu Intrepid ship the required patches in their > ejabberd packages, and there are rpms available as part of the XS > project, for those who want to set up community servers. > >> My take: >> >> 1. Whatever default policy we choose will be wrong for a significant subset >> of users. > > The way OLPC builds ship, two XOs on the same mesh channel or the same > AP will see each other, out of the box. There's no server than can > handle being the default, so it's simple: ship with no server > configured. > > That relies on link local presence/collaboration actually working: if > it isn't, you something to fix, since it works fine on OLPC 8.2.0 and > other distros. > >> 2. Collaboration must be one of the "killer apps", and even if it doesn't >> work out of the box *trivially*, it should be possible for users to iterate >> through the possible collaboration network options with miminal pain. >> >> 3. Can we discuss this at next week's Sugar conference? To me, answering >> these questions is worth a day or more of face time. > > Unfortunately I won't be there in person but I'll try to participate > remotely if time zones permit. > > Regards > Morgan >

1 0

Re: [IAEP] Announcing Fedora Sugar Spin!
by Greg DeKoenigsberg 12 Nov '08

12 Nov '08

On Wed, 12 Nov 2008, Bill Kerr wrote: > Meaning what, exactly? Can you be more specific? > > Well, it's meant to be possible for collaboration to work out of the > box. This did not happen with Wolfgang's Live CD converted to USB keys. > > Someone reported earlier on this list that collaboration did work from > USB keys on a Ubuntu network > > from morgan collett: "Link local presence should "just work", but I've > never used the LiveCD images." > > At any rate Morgan asked us for some files and after they were sent > reported back: > > from morgan collett: > "Thanks for the logs. presenceservice.log shows that salut > (LinkLocalPlugin) starts up successfully but doesn't detect anyone on > the local network. gabble (ServerPlugin) repeatedly attempts to > connect to a jabber server but fails - nevertheless salut is running." > > After this one of my students built a jabber server and we could do > collaboration through that > > I was hoping that with the new Fedora USB key we could do collaboration > out of the box, meaning without using the jabber server > > All I tested with the new Fedora USB key was trying to connect through > Chat but that didn't work > > Let me know if you want more information or diagnostic files again - I > can look up the details or ask joel for help if needed - just tell me > exactly the information you need > > a bit more detail of the history here: > http://xo-whs.wikispaces.com/connectivity Ah, right. So what we have is a complex policy issue, but it boils down to this: With whom should a new Sugar user be "collaborating" by default? Many options here. Machines on the local mesh subnet? Should there be a default jabberd server? Should there be discoverability of all jabberd servers in the world? My take: 1. Whatever default policy we choose will be wrong for a significant subset of users. 2. Collaboration must be one of the "killer apps", and even if it doesn't work out of the box *trivially*, it should be possible for users to iterate through the possible collaboration network options with miminal pain. 3. Can we discuss this at next week's Sugar conference? To me, answering these questions is worth a day or more of face time. --g

1 0

Re: [IAEP] Announcing Fedora Sugar Spin!
by Greg DeKoenigsberg 11 Nov '08

11 Nov '08

On Tue, 11 Nov 2008, Bill Kerr wrote: > Problems: > * not enough activities This will become better over time. Since we need to package activities for Fedora and they need to be reviewed, there can be a bit of a lag. The activities should be coming online continually. > * collaboration did not work out of the box when tested on my network > at school :-( Meaning what, exactly? Can you be more specific? > * shutdown does not work from drop down xo icon Yeah, I noticed that in my previous attempts, too. --g

1 0

Announcing Fedora Sugar Spin!
by Sebastian Dziallas 03 Nov '08

03 Nov '08

Hi everybody, I'm proud to be announce the availability of our Fedora Sugar Spin, which incorporates the Sugar Desktop Environment on a Fedora Live CD. So, what is this in specific? With this spin, you'll be able to run Sugar, which is developed by Sugarlabs and the desktop environment used on the OLPC, directly from a Live CD! You'll find several activities on the image including most notably... * sugar-browse - a web browsing activity based on xulrunner * sugar-write - a word processor based on abiword ...among with several other applications introducing e.g. chat support. We, the OLPC SIG, will be importing further activities into Fedora, which might be installed using 'yum install sugar-*' at a later time. Where can you get it? Easily, here: http://sdz.fedorapeople.org/olpc/sugar-spin.iso Here's the SHA1 checksum, just if you're interested: f032ab45aa116c2728dcd2d676e29a5ee114fd1d sugar-spin.iso And what if you wanted to put it quickly onto your USB Key? Even easier! You'll just need to grab Luke Macken's liveusb-creator, which already includes support for the Sugar Spin. Here's the link: https://fedorahosted.org/releases/l/i/liveusb-creator/liveusb-creator-3.0.z… Thank you everybody, who made this possible! --Sebastian

3 3

Reviving Education SIG
by Sebastian Dziallas 02 Nov '08

02 Nov '08

Hi everybody, it has been calm over the past weeks here. In fact, alarmingly calm. I had a talk with Rex some time ago and we decided that some things needed to change here. So why am I posting and why are we doing this? * to make you aware that we've an almost empty wishlist here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/Education/Apps#Wishlist * to show you that there's still a lot of work to be done (tasks): https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/Education/Meetings * to bring other things than "just spins" to the surface * to *not* let this project die easily Again, we *need* some kind of feedback from the people! So please speak up, if you're interested, have an idea or want to help. Kind Regards, Sebastian Dziallas

2 1

2024

2023

2022

2021

2020

2019

2018

2017

2016

2015

2014

2013

2012

2011

2010

2009

2008

2007

2006

education November 2008