meetingminutes April 2012

meetingminutes@lists.fedoraproject.org

22 participants
58 discussions

Summary/Minutes from today's Fedora infrastructure meeting (2012-04-19) (new time)
by Kevin Fenzi 19 Apr '12

19 Apr '12

============================================ #fedora-meeting: Infrastructure (2012-04-19) ============================================ Meeting started by nirik at 18:00:00 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-19/infrastructure.2… . Meeting summary --------------- * Robot Roll Call (nirik, 18:00:01) * New folks introductions and Apprentice tasks. (nirik, 18:02:13) * two factor auth status (nirik, 18:04:02) * Staging re-work status (nirik, 18:04:29) * Applications status / discussion (nirik, 18:06:38) * reviews needed to move fedmsg ahead. (nirik, 18:10:09) * ACTION: threebean to post list (nirik, 18:10:20) * LINK: http://gitorious.org/sticky-notes (nirik, 18:12:46) * looking at sticky-notes for a pastebin server (nirik, 18:14:03) * Meeting time (nirik, 18:17:44) * Upcoming Tasks/Items (nirik, 18:19:34) * 2012-05-01 to 2012-05-15 - F17 Final Freeze. (nirik, 18:19:43) * 2012-05-01 - nag fi-apprentices. (nirik, 18:19:43) * 2011-05-03 - gitweb-cache removal day. (nirik, 18:19:43) * 2012-05-09 - Check if puppet works on f17 yet. (nirik, 18:19:43) * 2012-05-10 - drop inactive fi-apprentices (nirik, 18:19:43) * 2012-05-15 - F17 release (nirik, 18:19:44) * Private Cloud (nirik, 18:22:06) * waiting for hardware, will move forward once thats done. (nirik, 18:27:23) * Open floor (nirik, 18:29:28) * LINK: http://fedorahosted.org/koji and http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/ (nirik, 18:35:40) * need a solution to find builds that need lots of memory. (nirik, 18:41:12) * IDEA: ask koji developers upstream for a solution (nirik, 18:41:22) * ACTION: dgilmore to talk to mikes about koji options. (nirik, 18:48:22) * LINK: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fails_to_build_from_source (nirik, 18:53:06) * will setup initial ansible ssh keys for testing with. (nirik, 19:01:06) * LINK: http://images.srv1.elrod.me/stickynotes-fedora.png (CodeBlock, 19:02:33) * provide feedback on sticky-notes theme: http://images.srv1.elrod.me/stickynotes-fedora.png (nirik, 19:04:00) Meeting ended at 19:06:02 UTC. Action Items ------------ * threebean to post list * dgilmore to talk to mikes about koji options. Action Items, by person ----------------------- * dgilmore * dgilmore to talk to mikes about koji options. * threebean * threebean to post list * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * nirik (145) * skvidal (75) * dgilmore (35) * herlo (32) * codemaniac (11) * misc (9) * ctria (7) * CodeBlock (7) * abadger1999 (5) * zodbot (4) * threebean (4) * ianweller (3) * pingou (3) * mmello (3) * lmacken (2) * athmane (1) * smooge (0) * ricky (0) * mdomsch (0) -- 18:00:00 <nirik> #startmeeting Infrastructure (2012-04-19) 18:00:00 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Apr 19 18:00:00 2012 UTC. The chair is nirik. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 18:00:00 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 18:00:01 <nirik> #meetingname infrastructure 18:00:01 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'infrastructure' 18:00:01 <nirik> #topic Robot Roll Call 18:00:01 <nirik> #chair smooge skvidal CodeBlock ricky nirik abadger1999 lmacken dgilmore mdomsch threebean 18:00:01 <zodbot> Current chairs: CodeBlock abadger1999 dgilmore lmacken mdomsch nirik ricky skvidal smooge threebean 18:00:11 <nirik> who all is around for a infrastructure meeting? 18:00:15 * lmacken 18:00:19 * skvidal is here 18:00:23 * threebean is here 18:00:27 * athmane is here 18:00:31 * ianweller is last-minuting a physics lab report but will pay attention 18:01:18 * pingou 18:01:24 <dgilmore> buenos 18:02:06 <nirik> ok, lets go ahead and dive in. 18:02:13 <nirik> #topic New folks introductions and Apprentice tasks. 18:02:14 <nirik> If any new folks want to give a quick one line bio or any apprentices 18:02:14 <nirik> would like to ask general questions, they can do so here. 18:02:32 <nirik> any new folks? or questions on easyfix tickets or general getting started questions? 18:03:54 <nirik> ok, moving on then... 18:04:02 <nirik> #topic two factor auth status 18:04:03 <skvidal> no changes on 2fa - pto the beginning of this week. 18:04:18 <nirik> ok. We can ping it next week... 18:04:29 <nirik> #topic Staging re-work status 18:04:34 <nirik> I've worked on this some. 18:04:40 <nirik> I've commited docs on the new setup. 18:04:56 <nirik> please read http://infrastructure.fedoraproject.org/infra/docs/staging.txt and let me know if anything needs fixing. 18:05:18 <nirik> I'm going to try and get the bapp01->02 move done, and easyfix moved to production, then we can do the staging branch killing. ;) 18:05:53 <nirik> any questions on that ? 18:06:35 <nirik> ok, I'll schedule the actual staging killing after those other 2 things are done. 18:06:38 <nirik> #topic Applications status / discussion 18:06:44 <nirik> any news on applications this week? 18:07:08 <nirik> abadger1999 / threebean / lmacken / pingou / CodeBlock / anyone else who works on apps. ;) 18:07:33 <abadger1999> New python-fedora this week that should resolve some issues clients were seeing. 18:07:45 <nirik> yeah, thanks for that fix. 18:07:54 <lmacken> abadger1999++ 18:08:12 * nirik still doesn't fully understand it, but thats ok 18:08:16 <abadger1999> I'm not aware of any of our scripts that were running into this but it won't hurt them to update on the infra boxes. 18:08:58 <threebean> fedmsg progress - got a mediawiki plugin done and tested locally. waiting still on lots of package reviews. 18:09:13 <ianweller> he's alive! 18:09:44 <nirik> threebean: could you perhaps drop a list to the infra list? or a wiki page link or something? then we can try and divide them up... 18:09:54 <threebean> sure thing 18:10:08 * threebean writes that now 18:10:09 <nirik> #info reviews needed to move fedmsg ahead. 18:10:20 <nirik> #action threebean to post list 18:11:08 <nirik> ok, any other app news? 18:11:22 <dgilmore> where did we ever get with re-writing fpaste? 18:12:15 <nirik> dgilmore: oh yeah, have some news on that... 18:12:32 <nirik> we are looking at possibly using sticky-notes instead for the server side. 18:12:46 <nirik> http://gitorious.org/sticky-notes 18:12:47 <abadger1999> mmello, I believe was interested in helping out with reviews, too. 18:13:01 <nirik> it's under review, pending some fixes from upstream. 18:13:13 <nirik> athmane has found some issues and submitted patches to it. 18:13:24 <mmello> abadger1999: yes..I'm 18:13:32 <dgilmore> nirik: cool 18:13:44 <dgilmore> mmello: get to work ;) 18:13:50 <mmello> abadger1999: threebean is helping to understand the process and I'm currently review my first package 18:13:53 <mmello> dgilmore: :) 18:14:03 <nirik> #info looking at sticky-notes for a pastebin server 18:14:11 <dgilmore> nirik: would the current fpaste client work with the new server? or need rewritten? 18:14:18 <nirik> there's a command line 'pastebinit' already in fedora. 18:14:25 <dgilmore> cool 18:14:35 <nirik> so, we could look at making it obsolete fpaste and perhaps provide a compat link. 18:14:50 <nirik> it misses a few things like the --sysinfo tho. 18:15:18 <nirik> anyhow, it looks promising. 18:15:34 <codemaniac> hello nirik and everyone 18:15:44 <nirik> morning codemaniac. welcome. 18:16:01 <codemaniac> good morning to you too nirik 18:16:03 <dgilmore> nirik: :) figured id ask 18:16:09 <pingou> but php 18:16:15 <ctria> hi all. did i get lost timezones again? 18:16:17 <nirik> pingou: yeah, its php. 18:16:27 <nirik> ctria: meeting just started 15m ago. ;) 18:16:35 <nirik> any further news on applications? 18:16:35 <ctria> :( 18:16:49 <codemaniac> sorry for joining late team 18:16:56 <nirik> no problem at all. 18:17:24 <codemaniac> CodeBlock: you around ? 18:17:39 <nirik> ok, will move along then... 18:17:44 <nirik> #topic Meeting time 18:17:54 <nirik> is everyone ok with this meeting time? 18UTC? 18:17:59 <skvidal> +1 18:18:00 <pingou> +1 18:18:03 <ianweller> +1 18:18:07 <abadger1999> +1 18:18:25 <nirik> ok then... seems popular. 18:18:47 <codemaniac> yea niriki , i am very much comfortable with this time , its +5:30 UTC here 18:19:07 <codemaniac> +1024 18:19:13 <nirik> cool. 18:19:34 <nirik> #topic Upcoming Tasks/Items 18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2012-05-01 to 2012-05-15 - F17 Final Freeze. 18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2012-05-01 - nag fi-apprentices. 18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2011-05-03 - gitweb-cache removal day. 18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2012-05-09 - Check if puppet works on f17 yet. 18:19:43 <nirik> #info 2012-05-10 - drop inactive fi-apprentices 18:19:44 <nirik> #info 2012-05-15 - F17 release 18:19:53 <nirik> so final freeze is coming up. 18:20:25 <nirik> One thing I will probibly schedule soon is a migration of our hosted machine... hosted03 -> hosted01/02. Should be a pretty easy migration. 18:20:37 <nirik> anyone have other items they are working on they would like to schedule or shout out? 18:21:46 <nirik> ok, I'll take that as a no. ;) 18:21:55 <dgilmore> nothing here 18:22:06 <nirik> #topic Private Cloud 18:22:14 <nirik> just a short mention of our cloud plans.... 18:22:14 <skvidal> we have new progress? 18:22:35 <nirik> not really... but I made a wiki page: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure_private_cloud 18:22:58 <nirik> so, if people have suggestions/ideas, post them on list. 18:23:01 * skvidal counts backward from 5 18:23:16 <nirik> we are currently waiting for hardware still, but I think we have close to the config we want speced out. 18:23:32 <codemaniac> nirik: you have already finalized the budget and initial designs right , t 18:24:02 <codemaniac> what exactly the cloud is going to host ? 18:24:05 <nirik> codemaniac: yeah, for the initial part of it. We can hopefully expand it next year if it works out. ;) 18:24:11 <skvidal> codemaniac: read the page - it explains 18:24:12 <nirik> see the wiki page... 18:24:52 <nirik> so, I think it will be very handy once we have it in place. 18:24:56 <ctria> just curiosity, can't we have any cloud solution from red hat or this is what red hat proposes? 18:25:13 <nirik> as we get closer to deploying it, we will no doubt want lots of people to help test it and such. 18:25:22 <herlo> nirik: who's doing the work? I'd love to help. I should have some time in the next couple of weeks to ramp up 18:25:31 <nirik> ctria: we evaluated a number of cloud tech, and found eucalyptus to meet our needs. 18:25:52 <nirik> herlo: skvidal is point on it... we are kinda holding on hardware tho. 18:25:59 <skvidal> hi 18:26:13 <herlo> nirik: skvidal: okay, just ping me when you are ready 18:26:14 <skvidal> we have a test cluster running. it doesn't do a lot b/c of the lack of ips to use w/it 18:26:27 <herlo> nod 18:26:44 <nirik> yeah. hard to use when you can't get to it from outside easily. 18:26:51 <codemaniac> me too in , would like to offer whatever i can 18:27:23 <nirik> #info waiting for hardware, will move forward once thats done. 18:27:24 <herlo> what will it take to get more IPs? Or do we need to free some up elsewhere? 18:27:53 <nirik> the new hardware will have a pile of external ips for us to use. 18:28:01 <herlo> okay, great 18:28:14 * herlo is done asking questions now 18:29:25 <nirik> cool... 18:29:28 <nirik> #topic Open floor 18:29:42 <nirik> anyone have items for open floor? general questions? etc 18:29:59 <skvidal> global updates 18:30:14 <skvidal> should I go ahead and just shoot a yum update on most everything? 18:30:59 <nirik> yeah, I think so. 18:31:02 <abadger1999> +1 18:31:08 <nirik> catch back up after the freeze. 18:31:10 <skvidal> ok 18:31:37 <nirik> I don't think we need reboots tho. The last update kernel fixes several security issues, but not sure how much they apply to our setup 18:32:04 <skvidal> second thing 18:32:12 <skvidal> builders and koji 18:32:25 <skvidal> I'd like to take buildvm01 and 02 out of koji for a while 18:32:31 <dgilmore> skvidal: ok 18:32:31 <skvidal> so I can mess with them 18:32:44 <nirik> sounds fine to me. Not much build activity right now anyhow. 18:32:56 <skvidal> and I'd like to find out about more migration to having more builders be vm-based 18:33:32 <nirik> what were the next steps in that plan? 18:33:53 <skvidal> 1. we need a way of telling koji that some pkgs need A LOT of ram 18:34:13 <skvidal> 2. we need to convert more of the x86-## boxes to buildvmhost 18:34:33 <dgilmore> skvidal: we have no way today of knowing that 18:34:50 <codemaniac> A lame question , what is koji ? 18:34:52 <nirik> dgilmore: won't we need that for arm anyhow? and seed with their list? 18:34:58 <misc> codemaniac: the build hub 18:35:00 <nirik> codemaniac: not lame at all. ;) Our buildsystem... 18:35:11 <dgilmore> skvidal: for arm we have a seperate channel called heavybuilder, and it has a list of packages in the koji hub policy that it sends to that channel 18:35:13 <ctria> is there a list of packages to blame for LOT ram? 18:35:16 <dgilmore> but its not an automatic thing 18:35:23 <dgilmore> its a manually maintained list 18:35:25 <skvidal> dgilmore: oh - so we can't do that? 18:35:28 <skvidal> ctria: more or less 18:35:40 <nirik> http://fedorahosted.org/koji and http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/ 18:35:41 <ctria> then we could probably create a new channel and redirect them there 18:35:44 <misc> codemaniac: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Using_the_Koji_build_system should answer the questions do not hesitate to ask for clarification 18:35:48 <dgilmore> skvidal: we can but its prone to failure and will need constant tweaking 18:35:56 <ctria> in the new channel to have better specs for builders 18:36:07 <skvidal> dgilmore: having all of our hosts have 8GB+ ram seems.... like poor resource use 18:36:13 <nirik> dgilmore: does changing that need a hub restart? 18:36:16 <codemaniac> thanks misc, nirik .Sure i will ask 18:36:20 <dgilmore> nirik: it does 18:36:20 <skvidal> dgilmore: since 95% of our pkgs don't need even 2GB of ram 18:36:25 <nirik> thats a pain. 18:36:25 <dgilmore> skvidal: right 18:36:39 <herlo> skvidal: +1 to not using a hammer for all builders 18:36:41 <skvidal> I suspect the largermem pkgs are probably under 50 18:36:46 <nirik> wonder if we could ask upstream koji for a better fix... some on the fly thing. 18:37:06 <misc> and I think the list would not grow much over time 18:37:19 <dgilmore> nirik: well we could probably write the policy so that if the task load is above say 4 where 6 is the max it goes to a bigger builder 18:37:28 <herlo> I've run into similar issues, I think it's possible to have a koji setting for ram requirements. 18:37:43 <dgilmore> nirik: but there could be something under a load of 4 that uses lots of ram to say link 18:37:53 <nirik> yeah. 18:37:59 <dgilmore> the last load is dynamically worked out based on avaergae build completion time 18:38:05 <dgilmore> the lask load 18:38:10 <dgilmore> task 18:38:11 <herlo> lol 18:38:14 <misc> couldn't cgroup be used to track the ram used by a set of process ? 18:38:25 <dgilmore> misc: builders are all rhel6 18:38:53 <nirik> so, I guess we all ponder on the problem and try and come up with a good solution... 18:39:02 <skvidal> nirik: I think your suggestion is a good place to start 18:39:07 <skvidal> ask koji upstream for help 18:39:24 <misc> ok so can we track the memory on vm ? 18:39:25 <nirik> it would be nice to have a better solution for arm too... 18:39:33 <misc> I think that's how balooning does, no ? 18:39:36 <dgilmore> nirik: probably the best solution would be to have koji keep track of ram usage during builds and store that. then we could do things nicely 18:39:43 <dgilmore> but thats likely alot of work 18:39:43 <nirik> misc: the problem is that we get a package to build and we don't know how much mem it will need to build. 18:39:45 <skvidal> misc: you mean on the fly allocation of ram? 18:39:52 <misc> ( or maybe polling memory in the vm every minutes, to have some stats ) 18:39:53 <herlo> +1 nirik's suggestion 18:40:00 <skvidal> misc: normally the event which tells us it is out of memory is that it OOMs 18:40:01 <nirik> dgilmore: hum... yeah. 18:40:26 <dgilmore> we can somewhat safely make assumptions based on previous builds 18:40:30 <nirik> or perhaps a FTBFS run could also tell us which packages need more mem and we set the list based on that? 18:40:46 <nirik> at least it would be a good seed. 18:41:07 <dgilmore> i suspect that having a task load of more than 4 would cover 95% of cases 18:41:11 <dgilmore> maybe 100% 18:41:12 <nirik> #info need a solution to find builds that need lots of memory. 18:41:13 <ctria> there is definition for package name in koji policies http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Koji/Policies 18:41:22 <nirik> #idea ask koji developers upstream for a solution 18:41:44 <skvidal> nirik: hmm 18:42:04 <skvidal> nirik: so here's an idea of what i could do on buildvm## 18:42:14 <skvidal> it would take a while, though... 18:42:30 <skvidal> iteratively build every pkg on the 4gb they have available 18:42:37 <skvidal> and see which ones cause it to oom 18:42:53 <nirik> that would take quite a long while... 18:42:56 <dgilmore> channel = method createrepo :: use createrepo has req_channel :: req is_child_task :: parent source */gcc* :: use heavybuilder source */glibc* :: use heavybuilder source */kernel* :: use heavybuilder 18:42:58 <skvidal> I know :) 18:43:07 <skvidal> dgilmore: -ENOCONTEXT 18:43:09 <dgilmore> thats a snippet of the policy use on arm 18:43:28 <nirik> once we have the cloud setup, we could fire up N builders with 4GB and mass rebuild... :) 18:43:28 <dgilmore> it came aross bas 18:43:44 <skvidal> nirik: so... 18:43:49 <nirik> ceph is apparently another one. 18:43:58 <nirik> webkitgtk is also a pig ;) 18:44:01 <skvidal> nirik: I could convert an existing x86-## box 18:44:05 <skvidal> nirik: to buildvmhost 18:44:06 <dgilmore> skvidal: http://fpaste.org/QfFj/ thats the full current policy used on arm 18:44:16 <skvidal> nirik: and then i'd have 8+ builders to test with 18:45:00 <nirik> yeah, still will take a while, but less while. ;) 18:45:53 <skvidal> I'm open to other options... 18:45:56 <skvidal> considering our build load 18:46:03 <skvidal> I could probably rob 2 more machines w/o us losing out muchj 18:46:24 <nirik> I'm fine with that, but perhaps we should see if koji dev's have any brilliant ideas we are missing first? 18:46:24 <dgilmore> skvidal: sure. we really only hit the builders really hard for mass rebuilds 18:46:25 <skvidal> our peak afaict has been like 23% use 18:46:36 <skvidal> nirik: you're no fun at all ! :) 18:46:46 <nirik> I know, right? :) 18:46:52 <skvidal> nirik: I can bounce an email to buildsys list 18:46:58 <misc> dgilmore: technically, that's some form of mass rebuild, so maybe this can be done at the same time 18:47:20 <misc> ( or, if someone is gonna rebuild everything, this can produce a list of FBTS and a list of package that need more ram ) 18:47:40 <dgilmore> nirik: ill talk with the mikes 18:48:07 <skvidal> dgilmore: even better :) 18:48:12 <nirik> works for me. 18:48:22 <nirik> #action dgilmore to talk to mikes about koji options. 18:48:39 <nirik> misc: we typically only do mass rebuilds when there's a good reason... rpm payload change, gcc change, etc. 18:48:40 <CodeBlock> agh, late, sorry 18:48:41 * CodeBlock here 18:49:08 <nirik> misc: but we hope to use the new cloud setup to mass rebuild to check the FTBFS stuff. 18:49:11 <skvidal> nirik: I think I'd like the opportunity to see if I can do a sensible port of ftbfs over to mockchain, etc 18:49:38 <nirik> yeah, would be good. keeping in mind hopefully that it would be portable to the privatecloud. 18:49:52 <skvidal> it should just be ssh-based 18:50:08 <skvidal> so the only difference is how you get the instances started 18:50:13 <skvidal> not how you spawn off jobs 18:50:26 <nirik> yeah. 18:50:45 <skvidal> question about ftbfs 18:50:55 <skvidal> does that build all rawhide srpms against rawhide? 18:51:20 <nirik> yep. 18:51:34 <nirik> we can ask mdomsch for his scripts. 18:51:55 <dgilmore> skvidal: i believe thats how mdomsch did it 18:51:58 <nirik> I think it was just basically: build everything once, get list of fails, rebuild, cycle until you have no changes. 18:52:19 <skvidal> nirik: nod 18:52:26 <skvidal> nirik: I was checking on which base it built from 18:52:30 <nirik> but there's issues with that too I guess. 18:52:32 <herlo> can someone expand ftbfs for me plz 18:52:32 <skvidal> ie: did he take a single rawhide snapshot 18:52:40 <skvidal> Fails To Build From Source 18:52:42 <nirik> herlo: fails to build from source. 18:52:45 <herlo> tx 18:52:49 <herlo> skvidal wins! 18:52:51 <nirik> ie, you get the src.rpm we have in git and it doesn't work. 18:53:06 <nirik> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fails_to_build_from_source 18:53:25 <herlo> yeah, I have done something very similar with my koji project 18:53:44 <nirik> rawhide can be a challenge, since there's so many moving packages. ;( 18:53:50 * dgilmore needs to run 18:54:08 <skvidal> nirik: which is why I was thinking about taking a snapshot of rawhide into a local mirror 18:54:13 <skvidal> nirik: that all the builders can see 18:54:47 <nirik> you mean for the build repo/binary rpms? or the git repos building from? 18:54:51 <nirik> or both. 18:55:25 <skvidal> build repo/binary 18:55:37 <skvidal> so that what it is building against for the build time doesn't change 18:55:54 <nirik> yeah. 18:56:04 <nirik> although if we can get it down to under a day, it would be the same rawhide. ;) 18:56:18 <skvidal> I cannot fathom how many machines we would need for that 18:56:28 <nirik> large number... 18:56:32 <skvidal> dgilmore: can I convert x86-16,17, 18 over to buildvmhosts? 18:57:20 <nirik> skvidal: I think he had to run... 18:57:27 <skvidal> okay 18:57:34 <nirik> lets continue out of meeting on this... 18:57:36 <skvidal> ok 18:57:39 <skvidal> sorryt for running on 18:57:41 <nirik> anything else for meeting? 18:57:47 <nirik> no worries at all. Good to discuss. 18:58:06 <skvidal> one more item 18:58:26 <skvidal> does anyone else have any interest in ansible and/or tryting to write playbooks? 18:58:33 * herlo does 18:58:38 <herlo> just haven't had time yet 18:58:42 <skvidal> understood. 18:58:47 <herlo> will next week or two for sure 18:58:54 <skvidal> one last thing 18:58:58 <herlo> depending on what gets done with euca, I'd be up for it 18:59:01 <nirik> yeah, I'd like to look at ansible more too. 18:59:09 <skvidal> I didn't hear any horrible screaming about the ssh key thing last week 18:59:15 <skvidal> just some minor grumbling 18:59:27 <skvidal> so.... I'm going to go ahead and make a magic key and put it on lockbox01 18:59:44 <skvidal> and start playing with it on the builder installs I've been working on 18:59:51 <nirik> fair enough. 19:00:03 <nirik> it would only be those instances for now, right? until we expand ansible use? 19:00:09 <skvidal> exactly 19:00:12 <skvidal> nothing else will have it 19:00:23 <nirik> seems sane. Shake out any issues now 19:01:06 <nirik> #info will setup initial ansible ssh keys for testing with. 19:01:19 <skvidal> okay, I'm done with all my openfloor things 19:01:20 <nirik> ok, shall we call it a meeting? 19:01:23 <nirik> :) 19:01:36 <herlo> yup 19:01:40 <herlo> call it 19:01:43 <CodeBlock> I have one quick thing 19:02:00 <nirik> CodeBlock: go for it. 19:02:33 <CodeBlock> we talked about Stickynotes as a pastebin last week, I quickly made a Fedora theme mockup (showed nirik last week, but wanted to get some more voices about it) 19:02:33 <CodeBlock> http://images.srv1.elrod.me/stickynotes-fedora.png 19:02:44 <nirik> CodeBlock: oh, codemaniac was looking to see if he could help with dpsearch. If you catch him on-line, see if he can assist any 19:03:13 <nirik> I think it's a pretty good start... might need more blue. :) 19:03:14 <CodeBlock> nirik: cool, he's been trying to ping me and our schedules have been totally missing each other 19:03:48 <herlo> CodeBlock: oh, cool 19:03:52 * herlo looks 19:04:00 <nirik> #info provide feedback on sticky-notes theme: http://images.srv1.elrod.me/stickynotes-fedora.png 19:04:03 <herlo> oh, very nice! 19:04:30 <herlo> CodeBlock: I like the theme, I bet we could package that up pretty quickly 19:04:48 <herlo> ping me when you have a package and I'll do a review 19:05:02 <herlo> we can get that into the infra repo soon I hope. 19:05:02 <nirik> herlo: it's already up. ;) dcr226 has it up and I am reviewing. 19:05:07 <CodeBlock> herlo: Cool. It needs some coding work, I just wanted to get a working prototype, but I will continue working on it 19:05:09 <herlo> nirik: with the theme? 19:05:19 <herlo> I'm specifically talking about the theme 19:05:23 <nirik> herlo: oh, sorry, no, not the theme... 19:05:27 <nirik> yeah, would be good to get that in too. 19:05:28 <herlo> :) nw 19:05:42 <nirik> ok, calling it a meeting as we are over. 19:05:45 <herlo> nirik: yeah, knew about the stickynotes review 19:05:54 <herlo> CodeBlock: awesome. 19:05:54 <nirik> Lets all continue over on #fedora-admin and #fedora-noc and #fedora-apps. 19:05:58 <herlo> indeed 19:05:58 <nirik> thanks for coming everyone! 19:06:02 <nirik> #endmeeting

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FUDCon KL Meeting Minutes :: 2012-04-19
by Maverick 19 Apr '12

19 Apr '12

Hey folks, Thanks for attending the FUDCon KL Planning Meeting (2012-04-19). Following is the meeting summary; Minutes: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fudcon-planning/2012-04-19/fudcon_kl_2012.… Log: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fudcon-planning/2012-04-19/fudcon_kl_2012.… ======================== #fudcon-planning Meeting ======================== Meeting started by KageSenshi at 14:03:46 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fudcon-planning/2012-04-19/fudcon_kl_2012.… . Meeting summary --------------- * rollcall (KageSenshi, 14:04:05) * LINK: agenda is here : https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon:KualaLumpur_2012/Meeting:2012-04-19 (KageSenshi, 14:05:12) * announcements (KageSenshi, 14:05:28) * harish have bought all the tickets , except for those who are going to buy themselves, and also eltermino (KageSenshi, 14:05:51) * eltermino is still missing (KageSenshi, 14:06:05) * banner, lanyard designs are done, but yet to get quotes to print them (KageSenshi, 14:07:15) * Review of actions from last meeting (KageSenshi, 14:08:42) * LINK: last meeting logs : https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon:KualaLumpur_2012/Meeting:2012-04-12 (KageSenshi, 14:08:59) * we'll be using the lanyard design for sticker (KageSenshi, 14:09:35) * ACTION: KageSenshi to check up with harish on hotel booking status (KageSenshi, 14:11:58) * ACTION: KageSenshi to get formal quotes for stuff on saturday (KageSenshi, 14:12:13) * ACTION: KageSenshi to check up with gurdip on formal quote for bus service (KageSenshi, 14:13:23) * open floor (KageSenshi, 14:13:49) * ACTION: meng will work on beverage quote this saturday (KageSenshi, 14:14:27) Meeting ended at 14:17:27 UTC. Action Items ------------ * KageSenshi to check up with harish on hotel booking status * KageSenshi to get formal quotes for stuff on saturday * KageSenshi to check up with gurdip on formal quote for bus service * meng will work on beverage quote this saturday Action Items, by person ----------------------- * KageSenshi * KageSenshi to check up with harish on hotel booking status * KageSenshi to get formal quotes for stuff on saturday * KageSenshi to check up with gurdip on formal quote for bus service * meng * meng will work on beverage quote this saturday * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * KageSenshi (63) * zodbot (9) * Alvisyu (7) * meng (5) * vinz007 (4) * yassin_ (2) * TYSSeries (1) * jurank_dankkal (1) -- Kind Regards, Maverick MavJS @ freenode.net https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Mavjs http://mavjs.github.com 7BFA DB9D D509 94AC 115B 1A0E E435 A5E3 A738 392D

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i18n meeting summary (2012-04-19)
by Akira TAGOH 19 Apr '12

19 Apr '12

===================== #fedora-meeting: i18n ===================== Meeting started by tagoh at 05:02:49 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-19/i18n.2012-04-19-… . Meeting summary --------------- * agenda and roll call (tagoh, 05:03:01) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/I18N/Meetings/2012-04-19 (tagoh, 05:03:11) * F17 (tagoh, 05:06:32) * Input Methods (tagoh, 05:13:56) * Fonts and Rendering (tagoh, 05:25:24) * LINK: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/I18N/Google_Croscore_support (paragan, 05:33:32) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/I18N/Liberation_support (paragan, 05:33:39) * Open Floor (tagoh, 05:46:38) Meeting ended at 06:02:14 UTC. Action Items ------------ Action Items, by person ----------------------- * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * tagoh (49) * juhp (23) * paragan (11) * pravins (11) * anish_ (5) * zodbot (5) * fujiwarat (3) * dueno (1) * epico_laptop (1) Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4 .. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot

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FAmSco meeting 2012-XX-XX minutes
by Christoph Wickert 18 Apr '12

18 Apr '12

Minutes: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famsco.2012-04-1… Minutes (text): http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famsco.2012-04-1… Log: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famsco.2012-04-1… Meet you again next week Wednesday, April D25th at 22:00 UTC in #fedora-meeting! Regards, Christoph ================================== #fedora-meeting: FAmSCo 2012-04-18 ================================== Meeting started by cwickert at 22:01:14 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famsco.2012-04-1… . Meeting summary --------------- * Roll call (cwickert, 22:01:32) * y1nv sent regrets (cwickert, 22:03:50) * LINK: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/famsco/2012-April/001044.html (cwickert, 22:12:28) * New FAmSCo election guideliens (cwickert, 22:13:59) * New FAmSCo election guidelines (cwickert, 22:14:06) * igor said he'd support option 3 (cwickert, 22:16:13) * AGREED: : In order to make the transition to the new FAmSCo election guidelines, 7 seats were up for the F17 and earlier elections, and the F18 election will have 3 seats up for vote. The 3 seats that will be up for election will be the bottom 3 vote-getters from the F17 election. The 4 seats not up for election in the F18 election, will be up for election in F19. (cwickert, 22:25:42) * LINK: https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/report/9 (cwickert, 22:26:05) * FUDCon bids 2012 (cwickert, 22:26:22) * FUDCon EMEA 2012 will take place in Paris (cwickert, 22:27:51) * Transit flight from KL to Hong Kong to start Fedora contacts with HKLUG. (cwickert, 22:29:48) * kaio's flight is not yet reimbursed (cwickert, 22:30:10) * ACTION: kaio_ph to update #277 and nag harish (cwickert, 22:30:50) * ACTION: kaio_ph to update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FADHK201205 (cwickert, 22:33:31) * Funding request for Release Party F17 Surakarta (cwickert, 22:33:40) * AGREED: approve 1.401.000 IDR and have harish reimburse it ASAP (cwickert, 22:40:09) * requester needs to file a new ticket for food and drinks after the event (cwickert, 22:40:31) * Sponsorship request for Linuxwochen Vienna and LibreGraphicsMeeting 2012 (gnokii) (cwickert, 22:42:59) * AGREED: #285 is approved (cwickert, 22:45:07) * Sponsorship request for Linuxwochen Vienna 2012 and LGM (2-6) (cwickert, 22:45:27) * AGREED: #267 is approved (cwickert, 22:51:27) * Sponsorship request for Linuxwochen Vienna 2012 (rgeri77) (cwickert, 22:51:45) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Linuxwochen_Wien_2012 (gnokii, 22:54:40) * LINK: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/advisory-board/2012-April/011540.h… (nb, 22:57:20) * AGREED: #283 is approved up to 100 EUR for now (cwickert, 23:02:08) * ACTION: igorps to senad a reminder about urgent budget tickets (cwickert, 23:09:59) * nb's Petition for the Board to dissolve FAmSCo and call new elections (cwickert, 23:14:21) Meeting ended at 23:42:11 UTC. Action Items ------------ * kaio_ph to update #277 and nag harish * kaio_ph to update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FADHK201205 * igorps to senad a reminder about urgent budget tickets Action Items, by person ----------------------- * igorps * igorps to senad a reminder about urgent budget tickets * kaio_ph * kaio_ph to update #277 and nag harish * kaio_ph to update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FADHK201205 * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * cwickert (248) * nb (57) * kaio_ph (37) * herlo (32) * zoltanh7211 (25) * igorps (16) * yn1v (12) * zodbot (10) * gnokii (7) * dramsey (1)

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EMEA ambassadors meeting 2012-04-18 minutes
by Christoph Wickert 18 Apr '12

18 Apr '12

2 hour meeting, but very productive. A special thanks to our NA friends for coordinating the swag orders. Minutes: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/emea_ambassadors… Minutes (text): http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/emea_ambassadors… Log: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/emea_ambassadors… Meet you again on Wednesday, May 2nd (two weeks from now) at 20:00 UTC in #fedora-meeting! Regards, Christoph ============================================ #fedora-meeting: EMEA Ambassadors 2012-04-18 ============================================ Meeting started by cwickert at 20:01:12 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/emea_ambassadors… . Meeting summary --------------- * Roll call (cwickert, 20:01:54) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:EMEA_Ambassadors_2012-04-18 (cwickert, 20:03:15) * EMEA F17 media production (cwickert, 20:06:00) * sesivany is the point of contact for the F17 media production (cwickert, 20:06:31) * we have requested budget from FAmSCo at https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/280 (cwickert, 20:08:01) * Announcements (cwickert, 20:09:03) * FUDCon EMEA 2012 will take place in Paris from October 13th till 15th (cwickert, 20:09:50) * Ambassadors Schedule (cwickert, 20:13:02) * LINK: http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-17/f-17-ambassadors-tasks.html (cwickert, 20:13:12) * ACTION: gnokii to make a release event poster and flyer template, color and b/w. SVG should be fine, then people can still add some text like date, time and location (cwickert, 20:21:21) * LINK: http://duffy.fedorapeople.org/art/badge-stickers/sxsw-badge-stickers_draft1… (gnokii, 20:30:11) * ambassadors want a new sticker sheet. similar to http://nicubunu.blogspot.com/2009/05/fedora-stickers-kit-v2.html but according to the latest logo usage guidelines (cwickert, 20:31:21) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Marketing/Stickers (thunderbirdtr, 20:31:52) * thunderbirdtr, sesivany and ib54003 are willing to assist in the swag inventory project (cwickert, 20:39:44) * F17 media production (continued) (cwickert, 20:40:47) * AGREED: : EMEA ambassadors will order 6000 media, 4000 live and 200 installer. 1000 will directly go to RH (cwickert, 20:56:52) * Events (cwickert, 20:57:35) * LinuxTag 2012 will take place May 23rd - 26th in Berlin, see https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/LinuxTag_2012 (cwickert, 20:58:34) * ACTION: cwickert to finally send out a mail about LinuxTag (cwickert, 20:59:06) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/LinuxTag_2012#Fedora_Representatives (cwickert, 21:05:57) * ACTION: gnokii to send dmaphy tablecloth (cwickert, 21:12:22) * ACTION: cwickert to disuss the possibility of making new Fedora shirts with kital (cwickert, 21:17:56) * ACTION: dmaphy to file a ticket for the banner for Graz ASAP and directly assign it to somebody who actually has a banner (cwickert, 21:19:46) * Release events (cwickert, 21:25:51) * if you are planning a release event, please add it to https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F17_release_events (cwickert, 21:27:06) * ACTION: cwickert to send out a reminder about the F17 release events (cwickert, 21:27:23) * release events submission deadline was extended by one week. new deadline is April 27th (cwickert, 21:28:41) * Action items form previous meetings (cwickert, 21:30:49) * ACTION: gnokii to send a mail to the list that we need to collect all remaining media or at least have an overview what is left and where (cwickert, 21:32:14) * Open Floor (cwickert, 21:33:07) * LINK: http://inode0.fedorapeople.org/swag/fedora-pens.jpg (inode0, 21:43:06) * the EMEA ambassadors will order to 2k case badges and 2k stickers with the NA folks (cwickert, 21:53:13) * ACTION: shaiton_ and cwickert to get quotes for tablecloth (cwickert, 21:56:22) Meeting ended at 22:00:23 UTC. Action Items ------------ * gnokii to make a release event poster and flyer template, color and b/w. SVG should be fine, then people can still add some text like date, time and location * cwickert to finally send out a mail about LinuxTag * gnokii to send dmaphy tablecloth * cwickert to disuss the possibility of making new Fedora shirts with kital * dmaphy to file a ticket for the banner for Graz ASAP and directly assign it to somebody who actually has a banner * cwickert to send out a reminder about the F17 release events * gnokii to send a mail to the list that we need to collect all remaining media or at least have an overview what is left and where * shaiton_ and cwickert to get quotes for tablecloth Action Items, by person ----------------------- * cwickert * cwickert to finally send out a mail about LinuxTag * cwickert to disuss the possibility of making new Fedora shirts with kital * cwickert to send out a reminder about the F17 release events * shaiton_ and cwickert to get quotes for tablecloth * dmaphy * gnokii to send dmaphy tablecloth * dmaphy to file a ticket for the banner for Graz ASAP and directly assign it to somebody who actually has a banner * gnokii * gnokii to make a release event poster and flyer template, color and b/w. SVG should be fine, then people can still add some text like date, time and location * gnokii to send dmaphy tablecloth * gnokii to send a mail to the list that we need to collect all remaining media or at least have an overview what is left and where * shaiton_ * shaiton_ and cwickert to get quotes for tablecloth * **UNASSIGNED** * (none)

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Fedora Packaging Committee Meeting - 2012-04-18
by Tom Callaway 18 Apr '12

18 Apr '12

The Fedora Packaging Committee met at its regular day (Tuesday) and time (1600 UTC). Logs from the meeting can be found here: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-1/2012-04-18/fpc.2012-04-18… Minutes from the meeting can be found here: HTML: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-1/2012-04-18/fpc.2012-04-18… TXT: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-1/2012-04-18/fpc.2012-04-18… As a reminder, the Fedora Packaging Committee meets publicly and encourages community participation. Anyone can submit a draft of new guidelines or changes to existing guidelines (or even bundling exceptions) by following the process documented here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging_Committee#Guideline_Change_Procedu… ~tom == Fedora Project

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FAmNA Meeting (18 April 2012)
by inode0 17 Apr '12

17 Apr '12

====================== #fedora-meeting: FAmNA ====================== Meeting started by inode0 at 01:00:01 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-18/famna.2012-04-18… . Meeting summary --------------- * Roll Call (inode0, 01:00:25) * Announcements (inode0, 01:03:01) * NiveusLuna is now old enough to give himself actions (inode0, 01:06:06) * NiveusLuna is now 24 (NiveusLuna, 01:06:20) * LINK: https://fedorahosted.org/famna/report/9 (inode0, 01:08:38) * FAmNA welcomes graphite6 as our newest ambassador :) (inode0, 01:09:01) * Tickets (inode0, 01:09:48) * #32 (SELF Brainstorming) â€“ FAmNA general trac - https://fedorahosted.org/famna/ticket/32 (inode0, 01:10:28) * LINK: http://duffy.fedorapeople.org/hotdog/ (graphite6, 01:11:03) * LINK: http://git.fedorahosted.org/git/?p=beefymiracle.git;a=tree;f=sources (graphite6, 01:11:20) * LINK: http://duffy.fedorapeople.org/hotdog/hotdog.svg (graphite6, 01:13:43) * ACTION: graphite6 will create the button template and get a cost estimate (graphite6, 01:28:30) * #33 (2012 Fedora Merchandise Order) â€“ FAmNA general trac - https://fedorahosted.org/famna/ticket/33 (inode0, 01:30:53) * Open Floor (inode0, 02:17:02) Meeting ended at 02:21:35 UTC. Action Items ------------ * graphite6 will create the button template and get a cost estimate Action Items, by person ----------------------- * graphite6 * graphite6 will create the button template and get a cost estimate * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * inode0 (113) * nb (53) * VICODANAX (51) * graphite6 (47) * rbergeron (30) * NiveusLuna (13) * dramsey (12) * zodbot (10) * award3535 (10) * Sonar_Gal (9) * StabbyMc_ (9) * nirik (5) * Octayn (1) John

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[EMEA] FUDCon Paris Meeting Minutes
by Kévin Raymond 17 Apr '12

17 Apr '12

Hi folks, Please find bellow the meeting minutes, thanks to all attendees. http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-1/2012-04-17/fudcon-paris.2… ================================================ #fedora-meeting-1: FUDCon Paris Planning Meeting ================================================ Meeting started by shaiton_ at 18:03:16 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting-1/2012-04-17/fudcon-paris.2… . Meeting summary --------------- * Roll Call (shaiton_, 18:03:32) * Accommodation status (shaiton_, 18:10:45) * 50% of the price have to be paid by the 28th ofâ€¦ August. We have time :) (shaiton_, 18:11:57) * ACTION: shaiton to see if we can have our NPO on the accomodation contract (shaiton_, 18:16:22) * ACTION: shaiton sending back the accomodation contract filled, with breakfast dropped (shaiton_, 18:16:45) * there will be free wifi on this hostel (shaiton_, 18:17:50) * FUDCon date: 13thâˆ’15th, accomodation reservations 12thâˆ’15th (morning). People who wish to stay more will have to get back to me shortly (using the incomming wiki page) (shaiton_, 18:19:45) * FUDPub status (shaiton_, 18:23:05) * ACTION: team to see about which menu to choose (shaiton_, 18:27:31) * ACTION: Bouska to bring beer :) (shaiton_, 18:28:57) * ACTION: Achrg to see if feasable :) (shaiton_, 18:29:20) * Schedule proposal (shaiton_, 18:30:34) * ACTION: to start see about airline discount (shaiton_, 18:31:38) * ACTION: NOW to book the accomodation (shaiton_, 18:32:17) * ACTION: SOON to book the FUDPub (shaiton_, 18:32:33) * ACTION: misc to contact travel agencies (shaiton_, 18:32:44) * ACTION: to design booklets and tshirt by August (shaiton_, 18:33:44) * ACTION: to define lunch caterer in May (shaiton_, 18:34:07) * ACTION: to pay 50% of the accomodation price by the 28th of August (the whole price by the 27th of Sept) (shaiton_, 18:35:03) * ACTION: shaiton to fill a wiki page (shaiton_, 18:35:43) * Ongoing actions (shaiton_, 18:36:48) * ACTION: shaiton to create the above wiki page (shaiton_, 18:38:35) * ACTION: shaiton to get back to the OWF organization comitee (shaiton_, 18:39:45) * HELP: French people to give Universities contact for our communication (shaiton_, 18:41:07) * HELP: to get sponsorts (everyone is welcome to join us in this effort) (shaiton_, 18:41:49) * Open Floor (shaiton_, 18:43:56) * our weekly meetings are on Monday, during the French weekly meeting. Everyone could ask English questions there during the FUDCon topic. (#fedora-meeting-1 @ 18:30UTC) (shaiton_, 18:53:57) * ACTION: team to report on the fudcon-planning mailing list our irl meetings (shaiton_, 18:54:24) Meeting ended at 18:57:21 UTC. Action Items ------------ * shaiton to see if we can have our NPO on the accomodation contract * shaiton sending back the accomodation contract filled, with breakfast dropped * team to see about which menu to choose * Bouska to bring beer :) * Achrg to see if feasable :) * to start see about airline discount * NOW to book the accomodation * SOON to book the FUDPub * misc to contact travel agencies * to design booklets and tshirt by August * to define lunch caterer in May * to pay 50% of the accomodation price by the 28th of August (the whole price by the 27th of Sept) * shaiton to fill a wiki page * shaiton to create the above wiki page * shaiton to get back to the OWF organization comitee * team to report on the fudcon-planning mailing list our irl meetings Action Items, by person ----------------------- * Achrg * Achrg to see if feasable :) * Bouska * Bouska to bring beer :) * misc * misc to contact travel agencies * **UNASSIGNED** * shaiton to see if we can have our NPO on the accomodation contract * shaiton sending back the accomodation contract filled, with breakfast dropped * team to see about which menu to choose * to start see about airline discount * NOW to book the accomodation * SOON to book the FUDPub * to design booklets and tshirt by August * to define lunch caterer in May * to pay 50% of the accomodation price by the 28th of August (the whole price by the 27th of Sept) * shaiton to fill a wiki page * shaiton to create the above wiki page * shaiton to get back to the OWF organization comitee * team to report on the fudcon-planning mailing list our irl meetings People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * shaiton_ (96) * misc (23) * zodbot (6) * Achrg (5) * jsmith (3) * Bouska (2) * Casper_v2 (2) * nchauvet (2) * spot (2) -- Kévin Raymond (shaiton) GPG-Key: A5BCB3A2

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Summary/Minutes from today's FESCo Meeting (2012-04-16)
by Kevin Fenzi 16 Apr '12

16 Apr '12

=================================== #fedora-meeting: FESCO (2012-04-16) =================================== Meeting started by nirik at 17:05:17 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-16/fesco.2012-04-16… . Meeting summary --------------- * init process (nirik, 17:05:17) * #833 Clarify provenpackagers communication policy for making changes to packages (nirik, 17:06:38) * AGREED: Will add wording about contacting maintainers to provenpackager policy and announce. (+7) (nirik, 17:10:47) * ACTION: mmaslano to make change to wiki and announce. (nirik, 17:11:36) * #830 define requirements for secondary arch promotion (nirik, 17:11:40) * LINK: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Secondary_Architecture_Promotion_Requirements… (nirik, 17:11:40) * AGREED: Defer this issue a week and wait for more feedback/changes to draft. (+7) (nirik, 17:28:42) * #829 New proven packagers request: Pavel Alexeev(hubbitus) (nirik, 17:29:16) * LINK: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2012-4828 needs to go stable. (nirik, 17:34:58) * AGREED: request is approved. (+7) (nirik, 17:36:03) * Open Floor (nirik, 17:36:09) * ACTION: mjg59 will chair next week. (nirik, 17:38:58) * ACTION: nirik to update meeting process page. (nirik, 17:45:10) Meeting ended at 17:49:01 UTC. Action Items ------------ * mmaslano to make change to wiki and announce. * mjg59 will chair next week. * nirik to update meeting process page. Action Items, by person ----------------------- * mjg59 * mjg59 will chair next week. * mmaslano * mmaslano to make change to wiki and announce. * nirik * nirik to update meeting process page. * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * nirik (74) * pjones (22) * mjg59 (21) * jonmasters (18) * t8m (17) * notting (11) * bconoboy (11) * mitr (10) * limburgher (10) * mmaslano (9) * zodbot (7) * jsmith (2) * tflink (1) * sgallagh (0) -- 17:05:17 <nirik> #startmeeting FESCO (2012-04-16) 17:05:17 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Apr 16 17:05:17 2012 UTC. The chair is nirik. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 17:05:17 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 17:05:17 <nirik> #meetingname fesco 17:05:17 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fesco' 17:05:17 <nirik> #chair notting nirik mjg59 mmaslano t8m pjones sgallagh mitr limburgher 17:05:17 <nirik> #topic init process 17:05:18 <zodbot> Current chairs: limburgher mitr mjg59 mmaslano nirik notting pjones sgallagh t8m 17:05:23 * notting is here 17:05:27 * limburgher is here 17:05:27 <t8m> Hi 17:05:27 <mitr> Hello all 17:05:33 <mmaslano> hello 17:05:33 <nirik> sorry for the delay everyone. 17:06:16 <pjones> hi./ 17:06:30 <nirik> ok, shall we go ahead and dive in? 17:06:38 <nirik> #topic #833 Clarify provenpackagers communication policy for making changes to packages 17:06:39 <nirik> .fesco 833 17:06:41 <zodbot> nirik: #833 (Clarify provenpackagers communication policy for making changes to packags) – FESCo - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/833 17:06:54 <nirik> mmaslano: you were going to propose/make some wording changes? 17:07:23 <mmaslano> nirik: I'm fine with berrange proposal :) 17:07:35 <mmaslano> I won't correct English speakers ;-) 17:07:38 <mjg59> Hi 17:07:38 <nirik> yeah, seems fine to me too. 17:07:47 <limburgher> Agreed, sane. 17:07:55 <mmaslano> I'll add it to the wiki page 17:08:06 <nirik> +1 17:08:09 <mjg59> Works for me 17:08:24 <mitr> I'm not sure we want it that strict, e.g. for handling urgent issues or mass changes in rawhide preannounced on fedora-devel 17:08:44 <nirik> well, it says "should try" 17:08:48 <mitr> right 17:08:55 <pjones> Well, I wish he'd use the series comma, but sure, that's fine. 17:09:29 <t8m> I think the "should" already includes the common sense "when applicable". 17:09:31 <t8m> so +1 17:09:49 <mmaslano> +1 if voting needed 17:09:54 <mitr> +1 then, we can always weaken it later 17:09:54 <limburgher> +1 17:10:14 <mjg59> +1 17:10:18 <pjones> +1 17:10:37 <notting> +1 17:10:47 <nirik> #agreed Will add wording about contacting maintainers to provenpackager policy and announce. (+7) 17:11:08 <nirik> mmaslano: can you announce the change too? or would you like someone else to? 17:11:24 <mmaslano> nirik: I can send an email to devel 17:11:29 <nirik> thanks. 17:11:36 <nirik> #action mmaslano to make change to wiki and announce. 17:11:40 <nirik> #topic #830 define requirements for secondary arch promotion 17:11:40 <nirik> .fesco 830 17:11:40 <nirik> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Secondary_Architecture_Promotion_Requirements… 17:11:41 <zodbot> nirik: #830 (define requirements for secondary arch promotion) – FESCo - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/830 17:12:05 <nirik> so, any further feedback here? does anyone have proposed changes? 17:12:26 <nirik> there's 2 things on the discussion tab 17:13:25 <jonmasters> so we will have further feedback, but not today 17:13:34 <notting> i don't think we have an automation framework for image-based installation 17:13:35 <notting> do we? 17:13:48 <jonmasters> notting: in discussion, not currently 17:13:56 <jsmith> notting: We do for EC2 images 17:14:06 <mjg59> jonmasters: We mentioned 2 weeks ago that we wanted to vote on this today 17:14:13 <nirik> there's plans/thoughts of it, but nothing I know of currently. 17:14:13 <jsmith> (assuming you're talking about automation of image creation) 17:14:37 <bconoboy> there's been a lot of feedback on the fedora list, but none of it has gone back into the proposal. 17:14:48 <jonmasters> mjg59: sure, I'm just saying - yea - what bconoboy is saying 17:14:51 <notting> jsmith: no, verification of the results 17:15:07 <mjg59> bconoboy: I really don't think there's been a great deal of substantive feedback that would result in modification, but I may be interpreting the discussions differently 17:15:20 <tflink> notting: we have some install automation in autoqa 17:15:24 <jonmasters> aside from the more straightforward case of qemu, I do have some ideas for how to implement image-based test on PandaBoards and so on. 17:15:27 <mjg59> Let me go back and skim that again 17:15:30 <pjones> bconoboy: what feedback are you thinking there has been that needs to be integrated in? 17:15:47 * nirik personally was -1 for kkofflers proposal/thread. 17:16:03 <pjones> nirik: yeah, I don't think that even really merits a vote 17:16:11 <bconoboy> pjones: for instance, I did an item-by-item discussion and differed on a number of points. some people replied to some, but not all, of htose points- does that mean the things I said that weren't commented on were agreed to? 17:16:11 <jonmasters> agreed 17:16:19 <t8m> nirik, you mean the secondarification of all meaningful architectures? :) 17:16:32 <nirik> t8m: yeah 17:17:09 <pjones> bconoboy: well, I disagreed with the way you were going about it and then you stopped responding. I kindof thought that meant maybe you would bring it up in a different way if you still had objections. 17:17:14 <nirik> we could table this another week and regroup feedback? 17:17:33 <nirik> or discuss feedback to specific parts here / now? 17:17:34 <jonmasters> nirik: I would like that 17:17:40 <jonmasters> (the first) 17:17:41 <nirik> or both. 17:17:42 <mjg59> bconoboy: Ah, I see. I replied to your points, and you never replied - I'd interpreted that as you being happy with my clarifications 17:18:11 <t8m> bconoboy, if you have some concrete proposals to change the draft perhaps we could vote on them one by one? 17:18:25 <bconoboy> mjg59: I just thought you'd be doing another draft. Some points you clarified on list and I Think those should go back into the proposal and that updated proposal should be voted on. 17:18:26 <jonmasters> to me, though, the main two sticking points are anaconda and testing - both of which we have eyes on 17:18:52 <mjg59> bconoboy: Right, I just thought that everything I said was already clear from the language 17:18:59 <pjones> I don't think anaconda is really a sticky point; we're only saying anaconda should be there when we're talking about anaconda-appropriate hardware as the target. 17:19:16 <t8m> pjones, +1 17:19:19 <pjones> bconoboy: I think if you've got specific things you thing should be changed, you should send mjg59 some sample language 17:19:35 <mjg59> bconoboy: Mostly it seemed to be you asking for quantification of things that I don't think can be quantified 17:19:54 <jonmasters> can we ask for another week to collate feedback and straighten out any misscommunications? 17:19:59 <pjones> sure 17:20:02 <mjg59> Sure 17:20:03 <nirik> yeah, I don't think the anaconda requirement should be too much sticking point... there's wording there for resource constrained devices and such 17:20:05 <bconoboy> My general problem with the proposal is that it's even *less* concrete than before. Everything is nebulous and subjective. I think that's fine for an outline, but it isn't really a strategy for promotion. I think the outline is fine. 17:20:31 <pjones> bconoboy: I notice that you have not responded to my email (in response to you) about that. 17:20:32 <mjg59> bconoboy: Every time this has come up we've said that there's no way to provide a set of concrete requirements 17:20:44 <mitr> bconoboy: There just won't be a checklist with each item worth a specific number of points and a minimum number for acceptance. 17:20:45 <bconoboy> But what I'd like to see/hoped for was a description of what the relationship will be between the SA and FESCo/etc for the steps to advance. Right now it's just things that have to be done, but not how to approach them. 17:20:47 <nirik> The problem is I don't think we can make a strict technical requirement list that will result in automatic promotion 17:21:00 <t8m> nirik, +1 17:21:07 <pjones> bconoboy: I think the relationship between SA and fesco is *exactly* what the email I just referenced was about. 17:21:40 <nirik> so, I would urge communcation to keep as open as possible between fesco and arm folks... if one or the other sees something going the wrong way, let everyone know. 17:21:47 <bconoboy> nirik: Okay, I hear the "we can't set it all in stone today"... but a procedure for actually setting things in stone owuld be tremendously useful. 17:22:00 <bconoboy> IE, on a case by case basis. ARM today, $NEWARCH tomorrow 17:22:14 <jonmasters> nirik: completely agree that promotion is never guaranteed or automatic. Brendan is, however, reasonable in wanting more measurable specifics 17:22:20 <mitr> bconoboy: That procedure wouldn't give results any earlier than the vote on making the arcithecture primary. 17:22:21 <pjones> bconoboy: Message-ID: <4F7B1574.3080305(a)redhat.com> if you're looking to read it again. 17:22:22 <nirik> there are non technical issues that we can probibly never quantify. 17:22:23 <mjg59> jonmasters: No, he's not 17:22:30 <pjones> jonmasters: no. 17:22:42 <bconoboy> pjones: I'll go back and reread after this if we're goign to delay vote a week. 17:22:43 <jonmasters> mjg59: well, this is where you and I (shockingly surprising) are going to disagree ;) 17:22:43 <mitr> jonmasters: It's reasonable to want them, but not to expect them :) 17:22:49 <notting> what nirik said. i mean, even if mips hit all the technical points we might set up, i'm not sure i'd see the point of making mips a primary arch 17:23:18 <bconoboy> I hear the voice of FESCo saying no guaranties. That's fine. That's not what I"m talking about right now. 17:23:23 <pjones> jonmasters: as I said in the email - what we need is you to propose plans of how you're going to meet requirements, and us to provide guidance on if we think they're satisfactory or not. we need that level of flexibility if you're going to succeed. 17:23:34 <nirik> right. There may be arches that are technically able to meet these requirements, but due to lack of mindshare, lack of hardware our users could use or other non technical reasons we would never want to promote 17:23:51 <jonmasters> pjones: fine. Ok. To avoid going in circles, give us a week to regroup on this and give you some more meat to chew on next Monday. 17:23:58 <bconoboy> What I'm saying is that the proposal isn't procedural, it's just some notions of what must be done, it lacks the structure of how to approach the undertaking. That's what I'm looking for. 17:24:00 <mjg59> If you have a plan that sounds like it meets all of the reqirements we provide, then the overwhelming probability is that the architecture will be promoted 17:24:24 <pjones> bconoboy: see that email. really. 17:24:28 <mjg59> And we can spend a short period of time going back and forth to make sure that those plans match everyone's expectations 17:24:33 <jonmasters> bconoboy: I think the onus on us is to say for e.g. "here's how we will handle testing", etc. 17:24:39 <pjones> jonmasters: exactly. 17:24:42 <bconoboy> pjones: okay, looking it up now 17:24:52 <nirik> for example, I suspect ppc / s390 could perhaps meet those technical requirements, but I don't think they have enough mindshare or hardware our users could ever use to make it worth making them primary. 17:25:11 <jonmasters> pjones: I do get you, I understand what you're asking for, and that is reasonable. It it is also, eventually, reasonable to agree on a less nebulous list. But we need to get you more meat before you can do the same for us. 17:25:34 <limburgher> Right, FESCO needs final say. But I think it's reasonable to put out there what we want to see before we'll look at it. 17:26:14 <pjones> jonmasters: that may well be true. time will tell ;) 17:26:34 <jonmasters> ok, we'll get you a list of points kinda related to the ones on the draft. E.g. putting forward representation, how we'll handle builds, how we'll get board access to developers, how we'll test, etc. 17:26:45 <mjg59> #proposal Defer for another week to allow concrete change proposals 17:26:46 <nirik> proposal: agreed: defer a week for more discussion and feedback on draft. 17:26:52 <mjg59> +1 17:26:54 <notting> well, if they want one more week to respond, i'm fine with that. it's not like we have a time pressure for this yet. +1 17:26:57 <nirik> +1 here as well. 17:26:59 <limburgher> +1 17:27:12 <t8m> +1 17:27:15 <pjones> jonmasters: just as a point, though, it'd be good if you guys responded by, say, friday morning, so we could have some discussion /before/ the fesco meeting monday 17:27:21 <jonmasters> notting: and in fairness, there isn't time pressure per se. We want to do this /right/, not in a rush. If need be, it's F19 or whatever. 17:27:29 <pjones> jonmasters: that'd help move the discussion along more easily 17:27:34 <mitr> +1, just to keep this on agenda - I don't think it makes much difference whether the proposal is voted on 17:27:35 <jonmasters> pjones: that is a reasonable request. I apologize for not doing so properly before. 17:28:19 <jonmasters> Brendan has done an excellent job, some us need to make time to assist further, and this will happen before next week's meeting. 17:28:26 <mmaslano> +1 17:28:42 <nirik> #agreed Defer this issue a week and wait for more feedback/changes to draft. (+7) 17:29:10 <nirik> thanks for the input jonmasters and bconoboy 17:29:16 <nirik> #topic #829 New proven packagers request: Pavel Alexeev(hubbitus) 17:29:16 <nirik> .fesco 829 17:29:17 <zodbot> nirik: #829 (New proven packagers request: Pavel Alexeev (hubbitus)) – FESCo - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/829 17:29:38 <nirik> This was formerly a sponsorship request... he's asked for provenpackager to work on ImageMagick updates. 17:30:08 <notting> and now a meeting item due to not enough responses to that in ticket 17:30:29 <notting> in fact... no parseable yay/nay responses. 17:30:35 <t8m> so I stick with my previous opinion and give him +1 17:30:48 <nirik> I was thinking they could just request co-maintainer on those packages, but I suppose the set changes and could be a pain to get approved on all of them. 17:31:17 <limburgher> Yeah, it's a lot, given that it's ImageMagick. 17:31:25 <mitr> +1, in general I prefer having provenpackager quite open, and dealing with problems if they come 17:31:31 <mmaslano> I'm also for +1, he's doing packaging for a long time 17:31:38 <limburgher> +1 17:31:53 <notting> i'd be fine with it - +1 17:32:01 * nirik is a very weak +1 I guess. I still have the same concerns as on the sponsorship... communication needs to improve, etc. 17:32:25 <nirik> any other votes? 17:32:40 <mjg59> I'm ok with +1 17:32:51 <limburgher> nirik: Agreed, but again, it's ImageMagick, if there's a problem, A: we'll know and B: it's early in f18. 17:33:18 <nirik> limburgher: well, there's still a problem in f17 isn't there? or did that get fixed. 17:33:39 <nirik> no, it's still there. 17:33:58 <pjones> I really don't have an opinion 17:34:02 <limburgher> nirik: What still needs to happen to fix it? 17:34:58 <nirik> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2012-4828 needs to go stable. 17:35:14 <nirik> some dependent packages have already done so, but lack the ImageMagick package update 17:35:27 <nirik> or perhaps they haven't been rebuilt yet. not clear 17:35:45 <nirik> anyhow... 17:36:03 <nirik> #agreed request is approved. (+7) 17:36:09 <nirik> #topic Open Floor 17:36:16 <nirik> any items for open floor? 17:37:15 * nirik listens to the silence. 17:37:24 <nirik> oh, chair next week? 17:38:15 <nirik> don't all jump up at once... ;) 17:38:22 <mjg59> I'll do it 17:38:27 <mjg59> Been a while 17:38:58 <nirik> #action mjg59 will chair next week. 17:38:59 <nirik> thanks. 17:38:59 <t8m> I saw the mail on devel that we should establish a single chair due to inconsistencies in the mailing of FESCo meeting minutes :) 17:39:25 <t8m> anybody wants to be a chair for the whole term? :D 17:39:44 <nirik> I think as long as we all follow the process page it should be fine. 17:39:57 <t8m> people make mistakes :D 17:40:06 <nirik> I think adamw was just being grumpy in the middle of beta testing. ;) 17:40:33 <pjones> he's got a valid point, but I'm not sure it's quite a strong as he's making it sound :) 17:40:45 <t8m> sure, I see it that we just should be more careful in following the process page 17:40:55 * nirik nods. 17:41:07 <nirik> or clarify the process page if it's unclear in any places. 17:42:01 <t8m> nirik, I have the problem with sending the draft schedule 17:42:18 <t8m> nirik, not many people want to do it on Sundays 17:42:26 <nirik> yeah... 17:42:33 <nirik> perhaps we should make it send on friday? 17:42:38 <nirik> previous 'business' day 17:42:40 <limburgher> not a bad idea. 17:42:42 <mitr> sounds like the obvious answer 17:42:54 <t8m> nirik, +1, will you change the process page? 17:42:59 <nirik> but it also is sometimes hard to remember to do that so far in advance. 17:43:03 <nirik> sure, I can. 17:43:09 <nirik> if everyone is ok with that change? 17:43:11 <t8m> nirik, yeah 17:43:20 <mmaslano> sure 17:43:25 <notting> sure 17:43:45 <mjg59> I think that's reasonable 17:43:49 <nirik> we seldom add things over the weekend anyhow... 17:43:55 <mjg59> Especially because anything tagged over the weekend is unlikely to get read beforehand 17:44:51 <pjones> This is one of the big downsides to having the meeting on monday 17:44:57 <nirik> yeah. 17:45:10 <nirik> #action nirik to update meeting process page. 17:46:19 <nirik> ok, any other open floor items? 17:47:16 * nirik will close the meeting in a minute if nothing else. 17:48:59 <nirik> ok, thanks for coming everyone! 17:49:01 <nirik> #endmeeting

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Docs meeting summary -- 16 April 2012
by Ben Cotton 16 Apr '12

16 Apr '12

Meeting summary --------------- * Roll Call (bcotton, 14:01:29) * Release Notes (bcotton, 14:04:37) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Release_Notes_schedule (bcotton, 14:04:48) * Guide Status (bcotton, 14:09:14) * LINK: http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-17/f-17-docs-tree-tasks.html (bcotton, 14:09:22) * it appears POTs are due to translation by next Monday (bcotton, 14:10:17) * Live Images Guide and Burning ISOs have been updated for F17 (bcotton, 14:10:49) * Release Notes redux (bcotton, 14:13:00) * ACTION: randomuser to file a bug against RN for user-mounted media or just add the content (bcotton, 14:21:25) * Outstanding BZ Tickets (bcotton, 14:25:22) * LINK: http://tinyurl.com/lbrq84 (bcotton, 14:25:35) * Open floor discussion (bcotton, 14:26:47) * Open Help Conference (bcotton, 14:33:36) * LINK: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/2012-April/014169.html (pkovar, 14:34:48) * LINK: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/2012-April/014169.html (bcotton, 14:35:26) * Open Help Conference is Aug 11-15 in Cincinnati, OH (bcotton, 14:36:13) Meeting ended at 14:47:25 UTC. Action Items ------------ * randomuser to file a bug against RN for user-mounted media or just add the content Action Items, by person ----------------------- * randomuser * randomuser to file a bug against RN for user-mounted media or just add the content People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * bcotton (45) * jjmcd (34) * randomuser (21) * pkovar (11) * zodbot (3) * Capesteve (3) * Southern_Gentlem (1) * claneys (1) Minutes: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-16/fedora_docs.2012… Minutes (text): http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-16/fedora_docs.2012… Log: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2012-04-16/fedora_docs.2012… -- Ben Cotton Fedora Docs Leader

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meetingminutes April 2012