Would it not make sense to include this extension as RPM in Fedora - Worked really nice until the 5.0 release and i guess a simple recompile against the new xulrunner-devel could make it work again but no idea how
https://addons.mozilla.org/de/firefox/addon/kde-wallet-password-integratio/
On 06/27/2011 09:13 AM, Reindl Harald wrote:
Would it not make sense to include this extension as RPM in Fedora - Worked really nice until the 5.0 release and i guess a simple recompile against the new xulrunner-devel could make it work again but no idea how
https://addons.mozilla.org/de/firefox/addon/kde-wallet-password-integratio/
I'd love to see that working, but I also use Firefox sync, which looks like it's broken with this extension now. Since that's a core feature of Firefox 4 (RIP) it might be hard to justify pushing this by default until that's fixed.
-Bill
Am 29.06.2011 20:07, schrieb Bill McGonigle:
On 06/27/2011 09:13 AM, Reindl Harald wrote:
Would it not make sense to include this extension as RPM in Fedora - Worked really nice until the 5.0 release and i guess a simple recompile against the new xulrunner-devel could make it work again but no idea how
https://addons.mozilla.org/de/firefox/addon/kde-wallet-password-integratio/
I'd love to see that working, but I also use Firefox sync, which looks like it's broken with this extension now. Since that's a core feature of Firefox 4 (RIP) it might be hard to justify pushing this by default until that's fixed.
i do not understand why mozilla does not include kwallet integration in the core instead useless crap like "personas", but anyways i would love to see any integration in KDE/Fedora because passwords should stored in a central manager if available
On Wed, 2011-06-29 at 20:15 +0200, Reindl Harald wrote:
Am 29.06.2011 20:07, schrieb Bill McGonigle:
On 06/27/2011 09:13 AM, Reindl Harald wrote:
Would it not make sense to include this extension as RPM in Fedora - Worked really nice until the 5.0 release and i guess a simple recompile against the new xulrunner-devel could make it work again but no idea how
https://addons.mozilla.org/de/firefox/addon/kde-wallet-password-integratio/
I'd love to see that working, but I also use Firefox sync, which looks like it's broken with this extension now. Since that's a core feature of Firefox 4 (RIP) it might be hard to justify pushing this by default until that's fixed.
i do not understand why mozilla does not include kwallet integration in the core instead useless crap like "personas", but anyways i would love to see any integration in KDE/Fedora because passwords should stored in a central manager if available
Because it's not a KDE application. It's written for Gnome and uses the Gnome keyring stuff.
<rant> As I've said before, this whole separation of wallet functions between two different systems that don't talk to each other is stupid and counter-productive. It's as if each DE used its own version of libc. There's no basic technical justification for this. Each DE wants its own user interface? Fine, but they do essentially the same things, so why can't they both use a common library for keystore functionality? The whole purpose of a wallet is to make things easier for the user. As things stand, that only happens if the user stays with the apps from one specific DE and never uses those of the other. Does anyone out there actually do that? </rant>
poc
On Wednesday 29 June 2011 20:38:31 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
Each DE wants its own user interface? Fine, but they do essentially the same things, so why can't they both use a common library for keystore functionality?
Because it takes time to get there. :-) There are talks about this already.
On Thu, 2011-06-30 at 07:57 +0100, José Matos wrote:
On Wednesday 29 June 2011 20:38:31 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
Each DE wants its own user interface? Fine, but they do essentially the same things, so why can't they both use a common library for keystore functionality?
Because it takes time to get there. :-) There are talks about this already.
Do you have a specific reference? Last time I looked, these talks had been going on for a very long time and didn't seem to be progressing very fast. I'd be glad to be proved wrong.
poc
On 06/30/2011 07:38 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
On Thu, 2011-06-30 at 07:57 +0100, José Matos wrote:
On Wednesday 29 June 2011 20:38:31 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
Each DE wants its own user interface? Fine, but they do essentially the same things, so why can't they both use a common library for keystore functionality?
Because it takes time to get there. :-) There are talks about this already.
Do you have a specific reference? Last time I looked, these talks had been going on for a very long time and didn't seem to be progressing very fast. I'd be glad to be proved wrong.
poc
Talks .. mmm ... the best way to have this use a good library - is to build a good library that is better than what is there now.
There is no strong incentive to change a perfectly working tool to switch a new (and as yet unproven library which may have more bugs) just for the sake of using the same one as someone else.
i.e. If its useful - and someone builds a great tool - it will be used ... but just focusing on the commonality and not the goals and improvements is likely to (and probably should) not go too far ..
my views of course ... frankly in this case, I found seahorse's desire to be all things to all tools a complete wrong headed approach.
ssh-agent and gpg-agent are designed for a particular need and do that one need very well ... being all things to all people is not always the right way either ...
Am 30.06.2011 14:13, schrieb Genes MailLists:
ssh-agent and gpg-agent are designed for a particular need and do that one need very well ... being all things to all people is not always the right way either ...
maybe
but it's idiotic if you are using KDE no GNOME-App is using kwallet and if you are using GNOME no KDE-App is using the GNOME wallet, the userinterface can be DE specific, but storing the passwords in difeerent ways is simply dumb
On 06/30/2011 08:30 AM, Reindl Harald wrote:
maybe
but it's idiotic if you are using KDE no GNOME-App is using kwallet and if you are using GNOME no KDE-App is using the GNOME wallet, the userinterface can be DE specific, but storing the passwords in difeerent ways is simply dumb
right - and the default (I believe) for google-chrome is to use its own - which is DE independent :-)
Am 30.06.2011 14:47, schrieb Genes MailLists:
On 06/30/2011 08:30 AM, Reindl Harald wrote:
maybe
but it's idiotic if you are using KDE no GNOME-App is using kwallet and if you are using GNOME no KDE-App is using the GNOME wallet, the userinterface can be DE specific, but storing the passwords in difeerent ways is simply dumb
right - and the default (I believe) for google-chrome is to use its own - which is DE independent :-)
and the worst solution
i wonder that there was no common used solution on unix-like systems the past ten years to avoid such problems in the future
On 06/30/2011 09:17 AM, Reindl Harald wrote:
right - and the default (I believe) for google-chrome is to use its own - which is DE independent :-)
and the worst solution
i wonder that there was no common used solution on unix-like systems the past ten years to avoid such problems in the future
A library of tools is a good solution - but YAD (yet another daemon)with inadequate service is not (e.g. seahorse).
Its also not terribly hard to do - so the need to use a common one is pretty low - but would be convenient if they all used the same database store (and have choices what the store is - at least for the local storage - for remote store (which chrome also uses) - the issues are a little different).
Perhaps a clear definition of the goals, needs and how UIs work - and how the common applications could use this API and benefit would be helpful to would be tool builders.
gene/
On Wed 29 June 2011 15:08:31 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
<rant> As I've said before, this whole separation of wallet functions between two different systems that don't talk to each other is stupid and counter-productive. It's as if each DE used its own version of libc. There's no basic technical justification for this. Each DE wants its own user interface? Fine, but they do essentially the same things, so why can't they both use a common library for keystore functionality? The whole purpose of a wallet is to make things easier for the user. As things stand, that only happens if the user stays with the apps from one specific DE and never uses those of the other. Does anyone out there actually do that? </rant>
http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/secret-storage-spec Wanna help fix that? ;)
Am 30.06.2011 23:57, schrieb Ryan Rix:
On Wed 29 June 2011 15:08:31 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
<rant> As I've said before, this whole separation of wallet functions between two different systems that don't talk to each other is stupid and counter-productive. It's as if each DE used its own version of libc. There's no basic technical justification for this. Each DE wants its own user interface? Fine, but they do essentially the same things, so why can't they both use a common library for keystore functionality? The whole purpose of a wallet is to make things easier for the user. As things stand, that only happens if the user stays with the apps from one specific DE and never uses those of the other. Does anyone out there actually do that? </rant>
http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/secret-storage-spec Wanna help fix that? ;)
sounds good
i hope we will see this soon active and in combination with "oxygen-gtk" and some ff/tb-themes sonner or later it will really make no difference for kde-users starting a GNOME app
On Thu, 2011-06-30 at 14:57 -0700, Ryan Rix wrote:
On Wed 29 June 2011 15:08:31 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
<rant> As I've said before, this whole separation of wallet functions between two different systems that don't talk to each other is stupid and counter-productive. It's as if each DE used its own version of libc. There's no basic technical justification for this. Each DE wants its own user interface? Fine, but they do essentially the same things, so why can't they both use a common library for keystore functionality? The whole purpose of a wallet is to make things easier for the user. As things stand, that only happens if the user stays with the apps from one specific DE and never uses those of the other. Does anyone out there actually do that? </rant>
http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/secret-storage-spec Wanna help fix that? ;)
All I can say is it's depressing. A distinct impression of a project going nowhere. Very little mailing list traffic (and that mostly from one or two posters), a "recent changes" page that consists mostly of spam, you get the picture. No doubt the handful of people working on it are doing what they can, but after three years or so the spec is still at draft 0.1, the last code commit was over 6 months ago and the previous one 3 months before that, and nothing usable has found its way to a leading distro. That suggests either that a) the project is poorly focused, or b) too few people in the KDE and Gnome projects believe in it (NIH syndrome? who knows?), or c) both.
poc
On Thu 30 June 2011 19:15:33 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
On Thu, 2011-06-30 at 14:57 -0700, Ryan Rix wrote:
On Wed 29 June 2011 15:08:31 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
<rant> As I've said before, this whole separation of wallet functions between two different systems that don't talk to each other is stupid and counter-productive. It's as if each DE used its own version of libc. There's no basic technical justification for this. Each DE wants its own user interface? Fine, but they do essentially the same things, so why can't they both use a common library for keystore functionality? The whole purpose of a wallet is to make things easier for the user. As things stand, that only happens if the user stays with the apps from one specific DE and never uses those of the other. Does anyone out there actually do that? </rant>
http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/secret-storage-spec Wanna help fix that? ;)
All I can say is it's depressing. A distinct impression of a project going nowhere. Very little mailing list traffic (and that mostly from one or two posters), a "recent changes" page that consists mostly of spam, you get the picture. No doubt the handful of people working on it are doing what they can, but after three years or so the spec is still at draft 0.1, the last code commit was over 6 months ago and the previous one 3 months before that, and nothing usable has found its way to a leading distro. That suggests either that a) the project is poorly focused, or b) too few people in the KDE and Gnome projects believe in it (NIH syndrome? who knows?), or c) both.
poc
Or that there is a lack of developers to work on it. KWallet is a small project, as is gnome-keyring, and both are volunteer efforts. I'm sure they'd love any help.
On Fri, 2011-07-01 at 02:56 -0700, Ryan Rix wrote:
On Thu 30 June 2011 19:15:33 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
On Thu, 2011-06-30 at 14:57 -0700, Ryan Rix wrote:
On Wed 29 June 2011 15:08:31 Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
<rant> As I've said before, this whole separation of wallet functions between two different systems that don't talk to each other is stupid and counter-productive. It's as if each DE used its own version of libc. There's no basic technical justification for this. Each DE wants its own user interface? Fine, but they do essentially the same things, so why can't they both use a common library for keystore functionality? The whole purpose of a wallet is to make things easier for the user. As things stand, that only happens if the user stays with the apps from one specific DE and never uses those of the other. Does anyone out there actually do that? </rant>
http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/secret-storage-spec Wanna help fix that? ;)
All I can say is it's depressing. A distinct impression of a project going nowhere. Very little mailing list traffic (and that mostly from one or two posters), a "recent changes" page that consists mostly of spam, you get the picture. No doubt the handful of people working on it are doing what they can, but after three years or so the spec is still at draft 0.1, the last code commit was over 6 months ago and the previous one 3 months before that, and nothing usable has found its way to a leading distro. That suggests either that a) the project is poorly focused, or b) too few people in the KDE and Gnome projects believe in it (NIH syndrome? who knows?), or c) both.
poc
Or that there is a lack of developers to work on it. KWallet is a small project, as is gnome-keyring, and both are volunteer efforts. I'm sure they'd love any help.
Even if they are small projects, they clearly have a critical importance, given the number of components that depend on them. Furthermore, I don't get the impression that the Secret Storage project is being actively supported by either side of the divide other than the representative of each side. That means they continue to be two small projects when they could be one larger project and maybe get somewhere. If the two sides were really interested in a unified solution, no doubt that would have happened before now. Draw your own conclusions.
poc
On 07/01/2011 11:08 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
Even if they are small projects, they clearly have a critical importance, given the number of components that depend on them. Furthermore, I don't get the impression that the Secret Storage project is being actively supported by either side of the divide other than the representative of each side.
I heard 3rd-hand/hear-say that gnome-keyring does indeed support this now...
-- rex
On Fri, 2011-07-01 at 11:51 -0500, Rex Dieter wrote:
On 07/01/2011 11:08 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
Even if they are small projects, they clearly have a critical importance, given the number of components that depend on them. Furthermore, I don't get the impression that the Secret Storage project is being actively supported by either side of the divide other than the representative of each side.
I heard 3rd-hand/hear-say that gnome-keyring does indeed support this now...
What does this actually mean? Can a KDE user use gnome-keyring instead of Kwallet to store all his passwords?
poc
-
Bill McGonigle -
Genes MailLists -
José Abílio Matos -
Patrick O'Callaghan -
Peter G. -
Reindl Harald -
Rex Dieter -
Ryan Rix