desktop March 2015

desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org

46 participants
42 discussions

Michael Catanzaro added to Workstation WG
by Paul W. Frields 19 Mar '15

19 Mar '15

Sorry for not doing this formally yesterday, time got away from me. Please welcome Michael to the open seat in the Fedora Workstation working group, as seen in yesterday's meeting notes. I'll fix the wiki forthwith! -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ The open source story continues to grow: http://opensource.com

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apps and launchers policy
by Matthias Clasen 19 Mar '15

19 Mar '15

I've found the document. Here are some suggested updates: For launchers: App launchers MUST have a unique[3] 128×128 launcher icon with an alpha channel and a matching High Contrast icon. I suggest changing this to say: App launchers MUST have unique[3] 128×128 launcher icons in both the default High Contrast themes. For the default theme, the icon should be full-color with an alpha channel. For High Contrast, the icon should be black-and-white or grayscale. I also suggest that we add the following to the "For applications" section: Apps SHOULD include the icons used by their launcher.[*] Apps SHOULD include a symbolic variant of their icon. with a footnote that says: [*] Relying on standard theme icons is likely to cause clashes where multiple applications use the same icon.

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completely impressed with linux's accessibility
by kendell clark 19 Mar '15

19 Mar '15

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 hi all. I couldn't sleep, so am up early. I wanted to write in to basically apologize for yesterday's completely unclear rant. I had an idea what I wanted to say but I was so frustrated I didn't ge tit out, I'll explain in just a minute. I've just completed converting another windows user over to fedora, always cause for celebration, and I just installed lots of updates with gnome software. You guys have done a fantastic job with gnome software by the way. I'm in the process of tracking down the one anaconda accessibility bug, and will file a bug when I have. How do I submit a patch? I don't have access to the git repository so can't push directly. The only purpose of that rant was to ask 3 questions. 1, When there are accessibility issues, how do I get developers who don't know anything about orca and at-spi interested in fixing them? Issues I often run into are developers complaining about the lack of good up to date documentation or simply that accessibility is hard. 2, how do I deal with persistent bugs? There is a persistent one at the moment with orca and terminal applications. It will sometimes fail to announce incoming text. Apparently the cause is something in vte, which all or most terminal emulators depend on. 3, how do I deal with the inevitable "just switch to windows, it's perfect" or "just switch to mac" developer? I also wanted to clarify some of my points. I only get frustrated enough to rant when a bug is persistent. I don't immediately go, oh my god there's a bug, then go onto the irc channel in a rage to attack the developer for not caring about us poor blind people. I only get that way when a developer seems disinterested in fixing a bug, tries to sell me on another platform or is hostile "why would I fix accessibility issues, I don't need that" is the usual response that can get me worked up. If I'm going to be part of the fedora community I've got to adjust my attitude. I think accessibility should be at a low level so there don't have to be as many layors between orca and what is on screen, but I'm no developer. I want to help developers fix their issues, not whine and complain about them. Most accessibility issues are really easy to fix. Simply do the following and it will work ninety percent of the time. If you're using a toolkit, such as gtk or qt, use stock widgets. Those all provide the proper accessible names and labels that orca needs. If you use custom widgets, provide AccessibleNames for your controlls, and set the correct role type. Remember to set focusable to true on controlls such as buttons, lists, etc so that orca won't skip them. Fedora tools already do this, and as a result I've had zero issues with any of the gui tools fedora puts out, great job! If it helps, now comes my explanation, poor though it is. I've been under a lot of internal pressure lately. I've been hearing about little else but windows 10 this, windows 10 that. I'm worried that this might be a threat to gnu/linux, because microsoft seems to be addressing some of the big issues that gave us an edge, although they're still not open source. When windows publications do review linux or linux laptops, they always seem to find something wrong with it. The thing that set me off yesterday was a complaint about scaling issues. Something to do with chrome not scaling right, and how this of course works fine on windows. I get so tired of the "windows just works" argument ... I got discouraged, and started circling. This got me thinking about how blind windows users have little interest in linux accessibility, and that got me thinking about how hard a time I have trying to get some developers, but by no means all, to fix accessibility issues. Linux is very personal to me and I believe in the open source principals. It's hard to go into anywhere, a mall, a store, etc where windows, and apple feature prominently. Store employees generally no little to nothing about linux, and I ... I don't know exactly. I want linux to be the thing on the news. THe thing people talk about, rather than ridicule or blow off. Linux? WHy would I use that, I use windows. Linux accessibility really isn't that bad. If I weren't surrounded by windows everywhere I turn I might be able to just relax for a while. It's ahrd to avoid though. And I'm rambling, this is a desktop fedora list. If I haven't damaged my reputation completely beyond repair, I'll straighten up and try to stay positive. A little reassurance off list wouldn't be unwelcome though. How do you long tiem linux users deal with "windows" people? Some of you likely use windows, and I don't fault you for it. I personally dislike windows but I don't mean all windows users when I mention windows. I mean the die hard, zealot, windows walks on water type of people, not the person that uses windows for gaming or because there's an app that only works in windows person. Off to get some coffee so I can start ironing out that anaconda bug. Thanks for reading Kendell clark Sent from Fedora GNU/Linux -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJVCX1LAAoJEGYgJ5/kqBTdWGYP/iQwB4hw8eEJQCP/aOueY3JK AleIlENnwOMiftwa8XOEqY2EVGLoKzjydfulHtumYTd46sw2THAn/gaAogQkb7Mz jcXZmJJ/lKQrwVwTcDemFRUX/z0QEkrtle3jBT1wvZVCDN7aHanpgHY5adbOaKwN QOkxVoOKB0btWFiyNSYPwxTZWz9fcLtGRmkEkBzRA7EKOV5bnHc5ug+YM/RdMOAz /Qs/gqZZuBnWgIGiWlN1vgN788P9p7k+d8ujNCz7n00fGyoWT0q4Qg4Hx7tGRUfK OUeoi+f19nGR725E5PDZPfhG6/yXB8O1Jwqrb8gkyXn/2piH+/+JsStbAPXKdTot weVb6dE7Rv7S/Bc2So+eHwArdTRW+oT3lVuOXyNMG95334FhoHiHaH2j1yGQ94eG SV7tK7D5SxTd7qJD1oeeXvAt/fRex7uqtWjrWxpivRWN8MVWK+AROOEKECO8L1XC KxNy9tU/ll6C6QFzoJs3Nri47VJ9NKJZbwkC8L3rPF3rEWNYN8EdlwNfOtCysFR9 VnJikhzVcBOh0wQdUzEGSyGiFo1ufkgTToLH8RAudUGMUs60mo0LOekC1/Qz33mK zzZRXc6/K3Q74Ee3mVKjHoUSYQ/3+1StAwh0wm8HA/qVfKoHz7eT/fpy3RcrrBuf CgUsZO4f9kWXiZ9HkAw0 =hgat -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Workstation WG Recap 2015-Mar-18
by Paul W. Frields 18 Mar '15

18 Mar '15

Minutes: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-03-18/workstation.2015… Minutes (text): http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-03-18/workstation.2015… Log: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-03-18/workstation.2015… * * * ====================================== #fedora-meeting: Fedora Workstation WG ====================================== Meeting started by stickster at 15:00:08 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-03-18/workstation.2015… . Meeting summary --------------- * Roll call! (stickster, 15:00:23) * Symbolic icons + release criteria (stickster, 15:04:39) * ACTION: mclasen locate the apps and launchers spec, and propose revision on desktop@ list (stickster, 15:24:56) * Suggestion was to add symbolic directory, possibly as subdir' to hicolor (stickster, 15:25:22) * Privacy policy (stickster, 15:25:45) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Pfrields/PrivacyPolicyRedux (stickster, 15:25:50) * More policy rewrites are on the way, should have another draft published soon (stickster, 15:30:43) * ACTION: stickster Update list with new draft once it's ready for review (stickster, 15:31:08) * Open seat (stickster, 15:33:16) * ACTION: stickster Start input gathering (via whenisgood.net) for new meeting time. (stickster, 15:36:53) * AGREED: Michael Catanzaro accepted for open seat (+6, -0, 2 not present) (stickster, 15:40:23) * ACTION: stickster Notify list and fix Workstation wiki page (stickster, 15:40:44) * Third party repositories (stickster, 15:41:18) * LINK: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_web_browsers#Summary_table is interesting. (stickster, 15:48:12) * LINK: https://repos.fedorapeople.org/repos/spot/chromium/ , F21 last updated in january (kalev, 16:08:47) * LINK: https://copr.fedoraproject.org/coprs/churchyard/chromium-russianfedora/ is the other i was thinking of (jwb, 16:09:29) * AGREED: Go for Chrome next (stickster, 16:15:39) * ACTION: cschalle stickster work up justification for Council and review gnome-software text for an appropriate warning to suggest (stickster, 16:16:12) * All Other Biznatch (stickster, 16:16:38) Meeting ended at 16:17:51 UTC. Action Items ------------ * mclasen locate the apps and launchers spec, and propose revision on desktop@ list * stickster Update list with new draft once it's ready for review * stickster Start input gathering (via whenisgood.net) for new meeting time. * stickster Notify list and fix Workstation wiki page * cschalle stickster work up justification for Council and review gnome-software text for an appropriate warning to suggest Action Items, by person ----------------------- * cschalle * cschalle stickster work up justification for Council and review gnome-software text for an appropriate warning to suggest * mclasen * mclasen locate the apps and launchers spec, and propose revision on desktop@ list * stickster * stickster Update list with new draft once it's ready for review * stickster Start input gathering (via whenisgood.net) for new meeting time. * stickster Notify list and fix Workstation wiki page * cschalle stickster work up justification for Council and review gnome-software text for an appropriate warning to suggest * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * stickster (103) * mclasen (45) * kalev (25) * cschalle (22) * jwb (17) * elad661 (9) * rdieter (7) * otaylor (7) * zodbot (6) Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4 .. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ The open source story continues to grow: http://opensource.com

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self introduction
by kendell clark 17 Mar '15

17 Mar '15

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 hi all I'm a new user to fedora, having just switched over from arch two days ago. My name is kendell clark, and I've been using gnu/linux since august of 2011. I find fedora, both the operating system and the community extremely pleasant and helpful. I'm blind, so depend on a screen reader to use my computer. The fact that fedora not only includes it out of the box but makes sure it's own tools are usable by a blind person is great. Thanks to all the hard working people who make fedora a great operating system for someone who needs assistive technology. I plan to join the fedora documentation team eventually, and to revive the accessibility guide which has been languerishing abandoned since, it looks like fedora 14. Much of the information is inaccurate, accessibility has come a long way and is a lot simpler to set up and use now. I'm also planning to set up a #fedora-accessibility channel for accessibility related discussions, bugs, etc. Would anyone in the main fedora project itself be interested in either moderating or idling in there? I was hoping for a few package maintainers, and maybe a person or two on the installer team? I'll of course be there, and I know of a few other fedora users who are blind, they might be there also. I want to make fedora even better, and make it an obvious choice for blind users everywhere. The bot from the main fedora channel might be useful, so that bug reports, new fedora releases, etc could be echoed there. Again, I can't wait to start helping out in fedora and thanks to everyone who puts their time and effort into fedora, it's an impressive gnu/linux distro Thanks Kendell clark Sent from Fedora GNU/linux version 21 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJVAQZkAAoJEGYgJ5/kqBTd0KoQAIGe2pvyy40vNKg0LF6HC3Kt Q+PSOfsE1XYeM1So/wH1RTTrMtcb8rsoOfh7RpHCfXuqd2k9eBDoamSrXJnj7Ozg IvOinqPVun5Mlet4lRK2qbUMjl+pCpsVvFDiASCiiWp5pW2Ykzp9S/kHjBVehrVv +rbVp7xXcGSUO8OMCsPKyqaMUtWVmF88+rzPUKGRafn4SdVAXKvoJeNVB2jJDTFW lx73syaUQiFYyPWwKSQJjwL715gOWB6oGWfxh8hCLP0Xe61v2BuASJ5F+VjDkMXF PGSL1w3Uq4antJeSnhy8AAYLQMfCFGirAYQcMA6SAG5HLuc0McvpwpL99T3vE5WR GYaXQGkg9qccfh8m4aZERuYcWudosNqdKk07WuSTdqUoqxb/TV6h1BhihSBgey7S rx1CTuL/xpqKDdSiRSA6Q2mNk4V5ZHu/R44V3i3YqO5BVXkTTToIEO5u+/WD6Pxz wOdokYYJ4FeYrmcfushk5B+ySs5Vcmf5YyVfb19S/NO1a40Yc6emyCeXudGWryxK 9j0NJDSC0V5yXhPaiBELAEXtN6c4zDaDpj3mxnjTI8d2/dDqyBEk00cxYxh4xqHA Ti1n7URNmo5NW2E3wUmw69dGNPE1YTfJy9TZ5p2ilG8vd07ElSlzAoVJEISGRieN y9Yibq7bMwRx0c03Wc1u =DLWV -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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gstreamer 0.10 is no more!
by Kalev Lember 17 Mar '15

17 Mar '15

... or more precisely, it's finally gone from the Workstation install media in F22 and we only ship with gstreamer1 now. The last remaining user was libpurple, which thanks to David Woodhouse's valiant efforts is now ported to use gstreamer1 as well. Happy Kalev :)

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Call for agenda for Workstation WG meeting 2015-Mar-18
by Paul W. Frields 16 Mar '15

16 Mar '15

Next meeting is Wednesday, 2015-Mar-18 at 1500 UTC/11:00am US-EDT. Please note the UTC time change. Agenda additions are welcome. Follow-ups: * Wallpapers -- any changes still needed? * Alpha announcement -- done Privacy policy: * https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Pfrields/PrivacyPolicyRedux * Other than the sharing section TBD, what appears not to be yet addressed in this new draft? Open seat: * Michael Catanzaro nominated * Any other nominations? Third party repositories: * Next actions -- Council justification needed -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ The open source story continues to grow: http://opensource.com

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Lilypond syntax highlighting in vim
by Kevin Tough 14 Mar '15

14 Mar '15

If this is not the appropriate place for this information please inform me. Fedora 22 Alpha 3 I've just tried the syntax highlighting of Lilypond files *.ly in vim. As a lilypond user I find the new highlighting very difficult to read. Generally I find the default highlighting in vim of all file types the best of many distros. Hopefully someone can change this in Fedora 22 before all lilypond users must tweek their own syntax files. If someone has reworked the file then they should have another go at it. The bright pastel like colors are, at least on my machine, hard to read. Namaste, Kevin Tough

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F22 alpha 3 installer reset on chromebook
by Scot Doyle 11 Mar '15

11 Mar '15

The F22 alpha 3 installer resets the machine before the installer kernel boots, as also happened in F21, and as is described in bugzilla #1135793. I linked to the fix, but no one has responded. Should I file a new bug report for F22?

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Fwd: Positive Feedback
by Matthew Miller 10 Mar '15

10 Mar '15

This came in to the webmaster alias... forwarding it on. :) ----- Forwarded message from Brian Oswald <bjoswald(a)outlook.com> ----- > Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2015 10:13:09 -0400 > From: Brian Oswald <bjoswald(a)outlook.com> > Subject: Positive Feedback > > Hello, > > I realize you're just the webmaster and don't really deal with this sort > of thing, but I couldn't find another department to send this to. > > Anyway, I just wanted to share my positive feedback with Fedora, and > thank your team for such a wonderful workstation distribution. > > I am not a sysadmin, nor do I work in tech support, but that's also why > Fedora is so great: I can do everything from work to play without any > compromises. I literally popped in the USB stick, installed, and went (I > had to add the NVIDIA driver for my system to display properly, but a > minor inconvenience with RPMFusion!). > > Linux really has come a long way since the 90s, and I for one am excited > to see where you take me. Keep up the excellent work! > > Brian > > > > -- > websites mailing list > websites(a)lists.fedoraproject.org > https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/websites ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Matthew Miller <mattdm(a)fedoraproject.org> Fedora Project Leader

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desktop March 2015