desktop April 2016

desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org

37 participants
22 discussions

coredumpctl integration for F25
by Michael Catanzaro 14 Oct '16

14 Oct '16

Hi, Currently we have coredumpctl installed by default, but it doesn't work because core dumps are consumed by ABRT instead. I'd like to get coredumpctl working out-of-the-box. We can do this by changing our systemd presets [1] to disable abrt-ccpp.service. ABRT will continue to function thanks to the ABRT developers' work on coredumpctl integration via abrt-vmcore.service. There is a somewhat- reduced feature set, but I've been running this for several months happily and I haven't noticed any issues; my crashes are being reported to FAF, and I can manually report to Bugzilla. See [2] for details. This might be slightly controversial for two reasons. First, the big change here is that core dumps will appear in the magical and super- awesome coredumpctl tool in addition to ABRT, but would no longer be created in the cwd when ulimit is set appropriately (we would need to feature that in the release notes). This aligns us with upstream systemd behavior, but diverges from Debian and Ubuntu, which still create the old-style coredumps in the cwd. Second, my understanding is that the ABRT developers prefer to improve abrt-cli and tell people to use that rather than coredumpctl. But as coredumpctl is very mature (nicer) and cross-distro so it gets many more contributors, I definitely prefer to instruct people to use coredumpctl instead for C/C++ crashes. We could totally do this change for F24 as well as it should be just a one-line change, but in the spirit of beta freeze I figure it's probably best left for F25. Michael [1] https://pagure.io/fedora-release/blob/master/f/90-default.preset [2] https://github.com/abrt/abrt/issues/1108

8 21

Another round of default app discussion
by Michael Catanzaro 25 Sep '16

25 Sep '16

Hi, Recently the Workstation working group agreed to match the GNOME apps we install by default in Fedora with upstream GNOME's core apps. We will by default sync our default apps to upstream's, and make exceptions only for exceptional reasons if when proposed on this list. This adds a bit more cement to our status as the best GNOME distribution with minimal divergence from upstream. I worked upstream with designers and release team to move many desirable apps into core, to better match what we're currently shipping in Fedora. I also created a gnome-incubator metamodule upstream, which is where we'll put apps that we want to be core apps by design, but which we recognize are not yet ready to be installed by default in distributions. Currently that is home to bijiben, gnome-boxes, gnome- calendar, gnome-dictionary, gnome-music, and gnome-photos. Here is how we currently diverge from the new upstream recommendations: Apps missing from Fedora: epiphany, gnome-logs Extra apps in Fedora: bijiben, evolution, gnome-boxes, shotwell, rhythmbox I see little value in discussing Epiphany again right now. Let's make an exception for that. I have added Logs in Fedora just now, as I expect that will be uncontroversial and I don't see any value in diverging from upstream here. Bijiben is just not very good yet, and it's not under active development. There's no good reason for us to diverge from upstream here, and I expect it will be uncontroversial, so I've dropped it. I guess Evolution might be controversial; I use it religiously, and many of you probably do too. But the user interface is complex and confusing; users should not be exposed to this by default, barring drastic UI changes that are outside the scope of the Evolution project. Evolution is a great mail client for power users, but I'm confident that the average user will be better off with webmail services; folks who want a desktop client can simply install one, after all. We intend to replace it with GNOME Mail eventually, but nobody has started developing it yet. I propose we drop Evolution, but I have not done so yet, pending further discussion. Boxes has too many serious bugs right now, so it cannot go into gnome- core yet, but we intend it to eventually. Since this is a significant application, I have not yet removed it from our default install, pending further discussion. My main concern is that it would look odd for us to remove such a significant app from the default install, then bring it back in a year or two. On the other hand, users won't notice a thing unless they make a habit of reinstalling Fedora, and it's not good to include apps we can't fully recommend. It's not clear to me what choice is best here. I propose we make temporary exceptions to keep Shotwell and Rhythmbox, until their intended replacements, Photos and Music, move into upstream's GNOME core moduleset. That will very likely happen for Photos for F25. I'm less certain about Music. Michael

19 61

More test coverage for Boxes
by Jiri Eischmann 12 May '16

12 May '16

Hi, Boxes is the pre-installed solution for VMs on Workstation, but it doesn't get as much attention as it should. Currently development composes of F24 don't even work in Boxes on F23, so users who'd like to test F24 in the default VM app are out of luck. It clearly violates one of the release criteria:https://fedoraproject.o rg/wiki/Fedora_24_Beta_Release_Criteria#Guest_on_current_stable_release The problem is that even though Boxes is the default VM app in Workstation it's not among recommended Fedora virtualization tools the criteria is referring to: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Getting_starte d_with_virtualization Fedora QA also use solely virt-manager and they only test Boxes from time to time to make sure the basic functionality works. Boxes have been here for some time, it's our default solution, we should make sure it's the best working desktop VM on Fedora and work with Fedora QA on ways to improve the test coverage. I think we should start with adding Boxes to recommended virt tools. Does anyone have an idea if it needs to go through some committee or is it just "go ahead and edit" wiki page? Jiri

5 11

The status of Fedora Media Writer (was LiveUSB Creator)
by Martin Bříza 05 May '16

05 May '16

Hi, I was asked to come here and write a few words about the status of the new Fedora Media Writer for Fedora, in a few major points for now. I haven't read through the full meeting log yet so more stuff can follow down the thread. == Mac OS X Support I was not able yet to build a working .app package with the LiveUSB Creator for Mac. I have used probably every tool there is to freeze Python scripts while using direct Qt installs, Macports and Homebrew. Usually I hit issues either with missing dynamic library or broken QML imports. That means there's not a problem with the code itself but with the way how to distribute a usable package to the users. If there is anyone looking to help me on that, I have uploaded just a basic source code package to [1]. It's just a simple PyQt5/QML application with just two source files but fundamentally the same as the FMW. For now, I hope a Python3 port (yes, it's still Python2) will resolve this. An other option is just to ditch the horrible Python mess and rewrite the whole tool to a saner language that's actually portable. == Design I heard there are some raised voices regarding the design of the application, that it's not the same as the design on gnome-design-team's github. While there are some differences, I think they are mostly the same. The main difference now is that now you can choose your achitecture with a radiobox set in the main window below the name of your chosen Fedora flavor instead of a small popup. If you're concerned with the lack of headerbar usage, that's because the app is written in Qt - there's no direct support for putting anything into the header bar. == Windows Support Current plan is to distribute the application as a .exe installer created using NSI. Either the installer or the application (or both?) will have to be signed using a code signing certificate which we currently don't have but can be obtained for I think 14 euros per year for open source projects. As mentioned in the meeting yesterday, due to a communication hiccup between me and releng, I expected I will be the one building and signing the Windows package. Now we're trying to resolve this with dgilmore. Currently it seems we'll have to have a Windows machine running the builds or use upstream binary packages in Wine because it's not possible to just compile upstream Python using MinGW - it'd have to be heavily patched with some shady patches lying on random peoples' blogs. For future releases, it would be good to provide this as a single self-extracting interpreter, though - in a similar way Windows installer itself does it. That's about it for now. I guess there will be questions and I'm here to answer them. Martin [1] https://mbriza.fedorapeople.org/pythontest.tar.gz

10 32

Re: [Test-Announce] Fedora 24 Candidate Beta-1.2 Available Now!
by Adam Williamson 29 Apr '16

29 Apr '16

On Fri, 2016-04-29 at 15:13 -0400, Joerg Lechner wrote: > Hi, > it's curious. There seem to be another problem. I have documented it > in 6 screenshots, my technical English is not so perfect to explain > the situation clearly in words. The behaviour after installation is > the same without updates or after dnf update. In screenshot 1 and 2 > You see what happens during completion of installation after the > first reboot. The entry of the pw is unsuccessful, no connection to > wifi possible. In screenshots 4,5 and 6 I am using the way via the > network icon, if I click i.e on the wifi name the situation is the > same as in screenshots 1 and 2 - no connection to wifi possible. The > only way to connect is clicking on the "circle with the gear-wheel in > it", then another window with saying wpa2.... opens, entering in this > window the pw, connection to wifi is ok. Known problem? Bug? > Kind regards If I'm understanding correctly, when you try to set the wifi passphrase via GNOME Initial Setup (the wizard that pops up on first boot / login) or directly from the Shell overview, you get a Shell overlay dialog (like in screenshot 2), and that doesn't work, you don't get connected. Right? But if you go into nm-connection-editor and enter the passphrase there - that's where you are in screenshot 6 - it works. Right? If I've got all that right, I think you should file a bug on GNOME Shell, and I will see if I can reproduce it here too. Thanks! CCing desktop@ for info. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net

1 0

Status of developer assistant in Workstation
by Adam Williamson 29 Apr '16

29 Apr '16

Hi folks! So an F24 beta blocker was proposed today: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1330941 because devassistant is not in F24 Workstation, and we have a criterion requiring that all 'core applications' listed at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Workstation/Technical_Specification#Core_App… must be present. Now you might note that devassistant isn't in that now, so what's the problem? It's not in it because I just took it out :) https://fedoraproject.org/w/index.php?title=Workstation/Technical_Specifica… There was a meeting last year where its removal was agreed by the WG: https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/teams/workstation/workstation.2015-11-25-… but no-one updated the tech spec. There is an outstanding question, however. It seemed from the meeting that people might want to keep including the CLI, but in fact, the main 'devassistant' metapackage was removed from comps: https://git.fedorahosted.org/cgit/comps.git/commit/?id=3ba95e811800f0dd548b… so no part of DA is in current Workstation composes. I don't know if you want to do anything about that. But I felt it was at least sufficiently clear that DA was no longer considered a 'core application' for Workstation and thus we don't need to block the Beta on it not being present. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net

8 9

Progress on graphical upgrade?
by Michael Catanzaro 28 Apr '16

28 Apr '16

One of the major new features we've planned is graphical upgrades from F23->F24. This hasn't landed in F23 yet, so it's not yet testable. Could we have a progress update on this? Does it work reliably? The plan was to prepare Software 3.20 as an update for F23; is that going to happen? Will there be some way to opt-in to a test upgrade before F24 has been released, so beta testers can test it? It would be a shame if beta testers all upgrade with dnf instead, so we miss out on testing for this. Michael

8 11

Please test f24-backgrounds-24.1.1
by Luya Tshimbalanga 27 Apr '16

27 Apr '16

Hello testers and team, f24-backgrounds is updated with new version of default wallpapers in addition of its supplements. 24.1.1-1 is now pushed rather than 24.1.0-1 because of the recent changes based on feedback from Gnome Software maintainer. https://bodhi.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2016-b5b1c46d5f Please test it out from your favourite desktop environment for possible bugs. -- Luya Tshimbalanga Graphic & Web Designer E: luya(a)fedoraproject.org W: http://www.coolest-storm.net

3 2

Workstation WG meeting recap 2016-Apr-27
by Paul W. Frields 27 Apr '16

27 Apr '16

Minutes: https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2016-04-27/workstation.201… Minutes (text): https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2016-04-27/workstation.201… Log: https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2016-04-27/workstation.201… * * * =============================== #fedora-meeting: Workstation WG =============================== Meeting started by stickster at 14:00:00 UTC. The full logs are available at https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2016-04-27/workstation.201… . Meeting summary --------------- * Roll call (stickster, 14:00:04) * Approve release blocking deliverables (stickster, 14:04:59) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Program_Management/ReleaseBlocking/Fe… (stickster, 14:05:02) * AGREED: Release deliverable list looks fine, +7 / -0. (stickster, 14:14:27) * ACTION: stickster update the ticket at https://fedorahosted.org/workstation/ticket/9 (stickster, 14:15:20) * Third party software policy draft (stickster, 14:15:30) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Workstation/Third_party_software_proposal (stickster, 14:15:59) * ACTION: stickster Add back in provision on third party repositories not breaking Fedora dependency chains (stickster, 14:18:24) * stickster realizes the approval fo the draft to go to Council should have been noted a while back. (stickster, 14:36:28) * AGREED: Draft can go to council regardless of further xdg-app discussion, since that aspect is obviously still in motion (+7/-0) (stickster, 14:37:13) * xdg-app runtimes (stickster, 14:37:21) * IDEA: otaylor - we either (A) point people at Fedora-hosted, Fedora-based runtime; (B) point people at freedesktop.org-hosted, Fedora-based runtime; (C) give an option for people to do either (A) or a freedesktop.org-hosted, non-Fedora-based runtime (stickster, 14:38:49) * stickster moved mcatanzaro's suggestion out to the text as well, as noted on list (stickster, 14:45:46) * ACTION: otaylor to research what it would mean to have a freedesktop.org hosted runtime based on Fedora; what the policies would be around it, what buy-in we would need, etc, and will report back to the working group (otaylor, 14:49:28) * ACTION: stickster condense notes in wiki and clarify otaylor is researching this part (stickster, 14:50:35) * mclasen + otaylor meeting with rel-eng on Thu 2016-Apr-28 to discuss building xdg-apps (stickster, 14:52:07) * ACTION: stickster to move ahead with relaying draft to council after clarifying other wiki bits noted above (stickster, 14:52:42) * Open floor (stickster, 14:53:38) Meeting ended at 14:56:57 UTC. Action Items ------------ * stickster update the ticket at https://fedorahosted.org/workstation/ticket/9 * stickster Add back in provision on third party repositories not breaking Fedora dependency chains * otaylor to research what it would mean to have a freedesktop.org hosted runtime based on Fedora; what the policies would be around it, what buy-in we would need, etc, and will report back to the working group * stickster condense notes in wiki and clarify otaylor is researching this part * stickster to move ahead with relaying draft to council after clarifying other wiki bits noted above Action Items, by person ----------------------- * otaylor * otaylor to research what it would mean to have a freedesktop.org hosted runtime based on Fedora; what the policies would be around it, what buy-in we would need, etc, and will report back to the working group * stickster condense notes in wiki and clarify otaylor is researching this part * stickster * stickster update the ticket at https://fedorahosted.org/workstation/ticket/9 * stickster Add back in provision on third party repositories not breaking Fedora dependency chains * stickster condense notes in wiki and clarify otaylor is researching this part * stickster to move ahead with relaying draft to council after clarifying other wiki bits noted above * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * stickster (86) * cschalle (34) * mclasen (21) * otaylor (19) * zodbot (17) * rdieter (13) * mcatanzaro (11) * ryanlerch (9) * linuxmodder (1) * jkurik (1) Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4 .. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ The open source story continues to grow: http://opensource.com

1 0

Workstation WG meeting 2016-Apr-27 call for agenda
by Paul W. Frields 26 Apr '16

26 Apr '16

The Workstation WG meeting is scheduled for this Wednesday, 2016-Apr-27 at 1400 UTC (10:00 EDT, 15:00 CET). This agenda is open for additions/corrections; please send by tonight at 23:59 UTC. Sorry for short deadline. * Third party software policy draft approval * xdg-app runtimes * (your topic here) -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ The open source story continues to grow: http://opensource.com

2 1

2024

2023

2022

2021

2020

2019

2018

2017

2016

2015

2014

2013

2012

2011

2010

2009

2008

2007

2006

2005

2004

2003

desktop April 2016