Jiri Eischmann píše v St 03. 09. 2014 v 13:41 +0200:
Hi, yesterday in FAmSCo, we started a discussion what media we should produce for F21. We have been producing Multidesktop Live DVD for many releases, but with the Fedora.Next changes we need to revisit it. In FAmSCo, we've pretty much agreed that Multidesktop Live DVD is not very aligned with the Fedora.Next initiative where we want to emphasize the official products and those products should be delivered as clear offerings all the way to the users. Merging them with other spins means that the clear product offering is lost before it reaches the users. Although Multidesktop Live DVD is economically the best solution, it is not from the marketing perspective and doesn't deliver the message of Fedora.Next products.
Suggestions that have come up at the meeting:
- the Cloud product doesn't really need a DVD media,
- having one DVD with Workstation and Server Products,
- having separate DVDs with Workstation and Server,
- creating additional DVD with other flavors of Fedora (other desktops,
many other specialized spins?) if there is enough interest and demand.
Christoph Wickert is going to bring it up on the workstation and server group mailing lists and I'd like to start the discussion here because this is very related to marketing. Opinions? :)
Jiri
P.S. we also discussed replacing DVDs with usb flash drives. As much as we'd love to offer flash drives instead of DVDs it's still not a viable option because flash drives are still 10x more expensive than DVDs. Not much has changed there in the last two years :/
We discussed the topic in FAmSCo again. The topic was discussed on several mailing lists and we've only registered strong demand for DVDs of Fedora Workstation. There have been some suggestions to add Fedora Server to FW as a virtual machine, but no one has volunteered to execute this idea and we really need to move the matter forward. So the plan is to produce Fedora Workstation DVDs, 64bit only because we don't know of 32-bit computers which could run FW reasonably. We may also consider some less power hungry option for the regions of APAC and LATAM (probably Xfce Spin). But it only will be an alternative, Fedora Workstation DVD is what we want to distribute globally. The quantities and whether the alternative DVD will be produced is at the discretion of the regions because the production is paid from their budgets and they're the closest to users, so they should know the best what they need.
Other kinds of media might be also considered and used in the end, but it doesn't stop the DVD production because DVDs will remain our primary media for this release.
The plan is of course a subject of change. I just felt it was necessary to push it forward and propose a concrete solution because there is not much time left.
Jiri
On Wed, Oct 01, 2014 at 05:01:06PM +0200, Jiri Eischmann wrote:
The quantities and whether the alternative DVD will be produced is at the discretion of the regions because the production is paid from their budgets and they're the closest to users, so they should know the best what they need.
I think this is a good idea, particularly because the Ambassadors (both globally and regionally) should be best-placed in the project to judge media demand.
We should make sure to plan some budget for this (both in the remainder of this year and for next FY), and I think that we should to expand this even beyond per-region to considering per-event requests. At most events, we want to promote our unified Fedora message as designed by the marketing team, but there are other situations as well:
a. "grassroots' events like LUG meetings, where the ambassador on the ground may be involved primarily because of their work on or interest in KDE or some other spin. (And this isn't just desktops; I'd support some funding for making media for the robotics spin for a robotics meetup, if someone wanted to do that — Fedora _is_ the OS of choice for the world's best RoboCup team!)
b. Linux fests and events where we know that the audience's primary interest is going to be how the desktop they care about works on Fedora, not our Fedora Workstation developer target.
Matthew Miller píše v St 01. 10. 2014 v 11:53 -0400:
On Wed, Oct 01, 2014 at 05:01:06PM +0200, Jiri Eischmann wrote:
The quantities and whether the alternative DVD will be produced is at the discretion of the regions because the production is paid from their budgets and they're the closest to users, so they should know the best what they need.
I think this is a good idea, particularly because the Ambassadors (both globally and regionally) should be best-placed in the project to judge media demand.
We should make sure to plan some budget for this (both in the remainder of this year and for next FY), and I think that we should to expand this even beyond per-region to considering per-event requests. At most events, we want to promote our unified Fedora message as designed by the marketing team, but there are other situations as well:
a. "grassroots' events like LUG meetings, where the ambassador on the ground may be involved primarily because of their work on or interest in KDE or some other spin. (And this isn't just desktops; I'd support some funding for making media for the robotics spin for a robotics meetup, if someone wanted to do that — Fedora _is_ the OS of choice for the world's best RoboCup team!)
b. Linux fests and events where we know that the audience's primary interest is going to be how the desktop they care about works on Fedora, not our Fedora Workstation developer target.
The standard media production should be planned in regional budgets. At least we have money for it in the EMEA budget.
We don't have money for special media for particular events. That's something we may be able to cover from reserves (if we have any :) ). There is also a practical problem with production. The vendor we're using doesn't even produce pressed DVDs in quantities under 1000 and burnt DVDs are pretty expensive (up to $1.5 per DVD). DVD production in small quantities is expensive.
Jiri
On Wed, Oct 01, 2014 at 06:07:05PM +0200, Jiri Eischmann wrote:
We don't have money for special media for particular events. That's something we may be able to cover from reserves (if we have any :) ).
As I understand it, there's at least some.
There is also a practical problem with production. The vendor we're using doesn't even produce pressed DVDs in quantities under 1000 and burnt DVDs are pretty expensive (up to $1.5 per DVD). DVD production in small quantities is expensive.
Optical drives are an increasing rarity in new computers. They'll be going the way of the floppy soon enough. I think that for next year, we should deemphasize DVDs overall, instead focusing on fliers and promotional material. I know this is _also_ an extra cost, but I think it would be worth printing these on demand per-event with event-specific URLs, so we can better judge return rates.
If we move to USB sticks (rather than just ditching media altogether), I think we should follow the suggestions from earlier threads and raise the bar for getting one — perhaps even to the point of asking people to sign up for a Fedora account (and promising no spam, of course) if they don't have one, and visiting Badges to get the badge for that conference.
On 10/01/2014 11:01 AM, Jiri Eischmann wrote:
Jiri Eischmann píše v St 03. 09. 2014 v 13:41 +0200:
Hi, yesterday in FAmSCo, we started a discussion what media we should produce for F21. We have been producing Multidesktop Live DVD for many releases, but with the Fedora.Next changes we need to revisit it. In FAmSCo, we've pretty much agreed that Multidesktop Live DVD is not very aligned with the Fedora.Next initiative where we want to emphasize the official products and those products should be delivered as clear offerings all the way to the users. Merging them with other spins means that the clear product offering is lost before it reaches the users. Although Multidesktop Live DVD is economically the best solution, it is not from the marketing perspective and doesn't deliver the message of Fedora.Next products.
Suggestions that have come up at the meeting:
- the Cloud product doesn't really need a DVD media,
- having one DVD with Workstation and Server Products,
- having separate DVDs with Workstation and Server,
- creating additional DVD with other flavors of Fedora (other desktops,
many other specialized spins?) if there is enough interest and demand.
Christoph Wickert is going to bring it up on the workstation and server group mailing lists and I'd like to start the discussion here because this is very related to marketing. Opinions? :)
Jiri
P.S. we also discussed replacing DVDs with usb flash drives. As much as we'd love to offer flash drives instead of DVDs it's still not a viable option because flash drives are still 10x more expensive than DVDs. Not much has changed there in the last two years :/
We discussed the topic in FAmSCo again. The topic was discussed on several mailing lists and we've only registered strong demand for DVDs of Fedora Workstation. There have been some suggestions to add Fedora Server to FW as a virtual machine, but no one has volunteered to execute this idea and we really need to move the matter forward. So the plan is to produce Fedora Workstation DVDs, 64bit only because we don't know of 32-bit computers which could run FW reasonably.
With my Fedora Design hat on here, does this mean that the sleeve and disc designs could use the "Fedora Workstation" branding?
cheers, ryanlerch
Ryan Lerch píše v St 01. 10. 2014 v 12:41 -0400:
On 10/01/2014 11:01 AM, Jiri Eischmann wrote:
Jiri Eischmann píše v St 03. 09. 2014 v 13:41 +0200:
Hi, yesterday in FAmSCo, we started a discussion what media we should produce for F21. We have been producing Multidesktop Live DVD for many releases, but with the Fedora.Next changes we need to revisit it. In FAmSCo, we've pretty much agreed that Multidesktop Live DVD is not very aligned with the Fedora.Next initiative where we want to emphasize the official products and those products should be delivered as clear offerings all the way to the users. Merging them with other spins means that the clear product offering is lost before it reaches the users. Although Multidesktop Live DVD is economically the best solution, it is not from the marketing perspective and doesn't deliver the message of Fedora.Next products.
Suggestions that have come up at the meeting:
- the Cloud product doesn't really need a DVD media,
- having one DVD with Workstation and Server Products,
- having separate DVDs with Workstation and Server,
- creating additional DVD with other flavors of Fedora (other desktops,
many other specialized spins?) if there is enough interest and demand.
Christoph Wickert is going to bring it up on the workstation and server group mailing lists and I'd like to start the discussion here because this is very related to marketing. Opinions? :)
Jiri
P.S. we also discussed replacing DVDs with usb flash drives. As much as we'd love to offer flash drives instead of DVDs it's still not a viable option because flash drives are still 10x more expensive than DVDs. Not much has changed there in the last two years :/
We discussed the topic in FAmSCo again. The topic was discussed on several mailing lists and we've only registered strong demand for DVDs of Fedora Workstation. There have been some suggestions to add Fedora Server to FW as a virtual machine, but no one has volunteered to execute this idea and we really need to move the matter forward. So the plan is to produce Fedora Workstation DVDs, 64bit only because we don't know of 32-bit computers which could run FW reasonably.
With my Fedora Design hat on here, does this mean that the sleeve and disc designs could use the "Fedora Workstation" branding?
Yes, I suppose they should use the FW branding since the FW product will be the only content of the DVD.
Jiri
desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org
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Jiri Eischmann -
Matthew Miller -
Ryan Lerch