Is it possible to get rid of the shield on the GDM login screen (even if it's a hidden option somewhere)? It's really annoying to have to drag it out of the way or hit a specific key on the keyboard to dismiss it. And considering the behavior of other operating systems, as well as the history of Linux software, I don't think it's unreasonable to desire the ability to get rid of it.
I've seen https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=696330 but I'm not sure if it's the same shield (also, no one seems to take an interest in working on that bug). Although I'd suggest that the issue also be handled in the general Gnome screensaver usage too, that at least doesn't affect me anymore since KDE does its own thing when it comes to screensavers.
Thanks,
-Adam Batkin
On 03/17/2015 07:44 PM, Diogo Campos (gmail) wrote:
It's really annoying to have to drag it out of the way or hit a specific key on the keyboard to dismiss it.
Just type your password, dude.
That's not the issue. Once my monitors are in powersave, I usually nudge the mouse (or hit the control key since that can't do any damage) to force it out of powersave. I expect my PC to be right where I left it. The shield is not where I left it.
Just starting to type a password is not the answer. Sure, that may be a great shortcut for some people, but it's not obvious that's what I should do when I see the shield. And I use lots of computers with lots of operating systems every day, so having to do something different on only this one (drag away a useless shield - because let's face it, it *is* useless) forces me to think about something that should completely automatic.
I know it's a small thing, but I know I'm not the only one who thinks this way about the shield, and just because it's a small thing doesn't mean that it's annoying. I'm quite surprised that no one has at least made it configurable, given that it serves no purpose and is a different behavior than every other computer I have ever used (including most Linux until recently).
-Adam Batkin
Once my monitors are in powersave, I usually nudge the mouse (or hit the control key since that can't do any damage) to force it out of powersave. I expect my PC to be right where I left it. The shield is not where I left it.
Try ESC. Or ENTER. (but see below, anyway).
Just starting to type a password is not the answer. Sure, that may be a great shortcut for some people, but it's not obvious that's what I should do when I see the shield.
(drag away a useless shield - because let's face it, it *is* useless)
given that it serves no purpose
What you should do when you see the shield is look at the notifications and decide *if you really need to login/type-your-password*. So, I disagree. It isn't useless. It serves a purpose. (but If you don't use/like it, it's ok, just type your password - or hit one of the keys said above).
And I use lots of computers with lots of operating systems every day, so having to do something different on only this one.
and is a different behavior than every other computer I have ever used (including most Linux until recently).
Really, really, really not sure of this "GS Is The Only One Different" claim. But, you know, even if really different: different isn't worse. Different is Different. Different can be better.
I think the problem is that, while it is easy to just start typing the password or press ESC/Enter, these things have close to zero affordance - it is very much not obvious that this functionality is present. I think that it would be best to move the password box into the shield, or move notifications into the password screen, removing the shield altogether. Either way, there should be clear visual indication of what the user can do to exit the lock screen.
-Marco
On Fri, 20 Mar 2015 05:43 Diogo Campos (gmail) diogocamposwd@gmail.com wrote:
Once my monitors are in powersave, I usually nudge the mouse (or hit the control key since that can't do any damage) to force it out of powersave. I expect my PC to be right where I left it. The shield is not where I left it.
Try ESC. Or ENTER. (but see below, anyway).
Just starting to type a password is not the answer. Sure, that may be a great shortcut for some people, but it's not obvious that's what I should do when I see the shield.
(drag away a useless shield - because let's face it, it *is* useless)
given that it serves no purpose
What you should do when you see the shield is look at the notifications and decide *if you really need to login/type-your-password*. So, I disagree. It isn't useless. It serves a purpose. (but If you don't use/like it, it's ok, just type your password - or hit one of the keys said above).
And I use lots of computers with lots of operating systems every day, so having to do something different on only this one.
and is a different behavior than every other computer I have ever used (including most Linux until recently).
Really, really, really not sure of this "GS Is The Only One Different" claim. But, you know, even if really different: different isn't worse. Different is Different. Different can be better.
-- desktop mailing list desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop
On Fri, Mar 20, 2015 at 1:59 PM, Marco Scannadinari m@scannadinari.co.uk wrote:
I think the problem is that, while it is easy to just start typing the password or press ESC/Enter, these things have close to zero affordance - it is very much not obvious that this functionality is present. I think that it would be best to move the password box into the shield, or move notifications into the password screen, removing the shield altogether. Either way, there should be clear visual indication of what the user can do to exit the lock screen.
-Marco
fwiw 1) There are animated arrows on the lock screen showing the direction you need to drag it. 2) Pressing Escape to dismiss things has been a common pattern for years. 3) Windows 8, 8.1 and 10 have a similar lock screen shield that is dismissed in the same way.
I don't think any of the interactions with the shield are unclear or confusing.
Regardless, this is not the right place to discuss upstream design decisions.
1) There are animated arrows on the lock screen showing the direction you need to drag it.
I was thinking more of unlocking using the keyboard only, but I'm sure many would agree that the swipe-to-unlock gesture that that is(,) is not particularly well-suited to users using mice.
2) Pressing Escape to dismiss things has been a common pattern for years.
True, but I don't think that this allows us to get rid of elements that can make the user more confident in what they think the computer will do. (pressing the OK button to dismiss a dialog vs. hitting ESC and hoping for the best)
3) Windows 8, 8.1 and 10 have a similar lock screen shield that is dismissed in the same way.
So is this shield behaviour justified because of potential emigrants from Windows to GNOME or because Windows has Microsoft's backing?
this is not the right place to discuss upstream design decisions.
You're right, I'll stop
-Marco
V Fri, 20 Mar 2015 14:16:58 +0200 Elad Alfassa elad@fedoraproject.org napsáno:
fwiw
- There are animated arrows on the lock screen showing the direction
you need to drag it.
No it's not obvious. Not for me. Type your password to unlock is obvious for anyone.
- Pressing Escape to dismiss things has been a common pattern for
years.
Pressing Ctrl to wake up display and show unlock dialog has been a common pattern for years.
- Windows 8, 8.1 and 10 have a similar lock screen shield
that is dismissed in the same way.
Yeah, it took me five minutes to figure out how in the world am I supposed to get in. Seriously. And I'm not by in any way a newbie, I've been using computers since Win 3.1 and I've been a happy linux user, packager and even a little bit of a programmer since about red hat 7 (although full-time since fedora core 5).
I don't think any of the interactions with the shield are unclear or confusing.
Yes they are. To experienced desktop computer users at the very least. They might seem normal for people used to modern touch screen devices, but desktop computer isn't a freaking tablet for heavens sake.
Either have drag to unlock, or show a password dialog to unlock. Not both.
Regardless, this is not the right place to discuss upstream design decisions.
Yes, I realise, even though many of the people subscribed here are actually upstream devs...
Martin
PS: <uselessrant> The software of modern computers is becoming more and more complex under hood and at the same time more and more stupid and less and less usable. Devs are focusing on removing pretty much everything, or at least shuffling controls with every release. Less and less can be configured, bugs are getting more and more unpredictable, system more unstable, even if it has less features it needs more power and memory, icons are so simple they look like from b&w devices (not to talk about being visual guides, half of the icons are so simple they tell me nothing what are they for), gradients in UI are mostly gone, there are less and less obvious visual guides, even installation isn't a simple linear process any more. While sometimes disputed, modern UI is targeted primarily on tablet-like devices. Traditional mouse + keyboard users need different kind of UI, but devs try to satisfy both with one universal UI. Sorry, but middle way is almost always wrong. Please, focus on one, not both at the same time, they're incompatible.
Things like this are what makes my head explode when I need to work with Windows at work (especially with anything newer than Win XP) and they are the same things that made me finally switch from Fedora to CentOS. Sorry guys, but I need transparent, stable, yet sufficiently modern system with traditional desktop (thank heavens for xfce) that I don't need to reinstall/upgrade every 6 months. </uselessrant>
On Thu, Mar 19, 2015 at 08:10:48PM -0400, Adam Batkin wrote:
On 03/17/2015 07:44 PM, Diogo Campos (gmail) wrote:
It's really annoying to have to drag it out of the way or hit a specific key on the keyboard to dismiss it.
Just type your password, dude.
Just starting to type a password is not the answer. Sure, that may be a great shortcut for some people, but it's not obvious that's what I should do when I see the shield. And I use lots of computers with lots of operating systems every day, so having to do something different on only this one (drag away a useless shield - because let's face it, it *is* useless) forces me to think about something that should completely automatic.
The point is that you do not need to do anything different. On other OSes you start typing the password, here you start typing the password...
Zbyszek
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