I'm calling for a vote on the default DE used as a base for the Workstation Product. The overall discussion seems to have played out, so let's get things settled. As the subject says, I'm proposing we use GNOME as the default base of the product. WG members have one week from today to vote or counter-propose. Missing votes after one week will be counted as abstains.
PLEASE NOTE: I believe the WG would really like to see KDE be a release blocking alternative DE under the premise that we can work together with the KDE team and get consensus on the technical aspects of what Workstation should provide. However, I did not want to put two issues in the same vote before we've really had a chance to discuss those technical aspects, so the proposal is only for the default DE choice. We will vote on alternative DEs at a later time.
Thanks!
josh
Voting +1
----- Original Message ----- From: "Josh Boyer" jwboyer@fedoraproject.org To: "Discussions about development for the Fedora desktop" desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org Cc: "Christoph Wickert" cwickert@fedoraproject.org, "Christian Schaller" cschalle@redhat.com, "Matthias Clasen" mclasen@redhat.com, "Lukáš Tinkl" ltinkl@redhat.com, "Kalev Lember" kalevlember@gmail.com, "Jens Petersen" petersen@redhat.com, "Owen Taylor" otaylor@redhat.com, "Ryan Lerch" rlerch@redhat.com Sent: Friday, February 14, 2014 2:44:40 PM Subject: [Proposal for vote] GNOME as default base of the Workstation Product
I'm calling for a vote on the default DE used as a base for the Workstation Product. The overall discussion seems to have played out, so let's get things settled. As the subject says, I'm proposing we use GNOME as the default base of the product. WG members have one week from today to vote or counter-propose. Missing votes after one week will be counted as abstains.
PLEASE NOTE: I believe the WG would really like to see KDE be a release blocking alternative DE under the premise that we can work together with the KDE team and get consensus on the technical aspects of what Workstation should provide. However, I did not want to put two issues in the same vote before we've really had a chance to discuss those technical aspects, so the proposal is only for the default DE choice. We will vote on alternative DEs at a later time.
Thanks!
josh
On 02/14/2014 02:44 PM, Josh Boyer wrote:
I'm calling for a vote on the default DE used as a base for the Workstation Product. The overall discussion seems to have played out, so let's get things settled. As the subject says, I'm proposing we use GNOME as the default base of the product. WG members have one week from today to vote or counter-propose. Missing votes after one week will be counted as abstains.
I am +1 to GNOME being the base for Workstation.
On 02/14/2014 08:44 AM, Josh Boyer wrote:
I'm calling for a vote on the default DE used as a base for the Workstation Product. The overall discussion seems to have played out, so let's get things settled. As the subject says, I'm proposing we use GNOME as the default base of the product. WG members have one week from today to vote or counter-propose. Missing votes after one week will be counted as abstains.
PLEASE NOTE: I believe the WG would really like to see KDE be a release blocking alternative DE under the premise that we can work together with the KDE team and get consensus on the technical aspects of what Workstation should provide. However, I did not want to put two issues in the same vote before we've really had a chance to discuss those technical aspects, so the proposal is only for the default DE choice. We will vote on alternative DEs at a later time.
Thanks!
josh
+1 for GNOME as the default base of the Workstation product.
cheers, ryanlerch
Am Freitag, den 14.02.2014, 08:44 -0500 schrieb Josh Boyer:
I'm calling for a vote on the default DE used as a base for the Workstation Product. The overall discussion seems to have played out, so let's get things settled. As the subject says, I'm proposing we use GNOME as the default base of the product.
+1
WG members have one week from today to vote or counter-propose. Missing votes after one week will be counted as abstains.
Frankly speaking I think this is not subject to discussion. KDE needs to remain a release blocking desktop. Improving our workstation product should not happen at the cost of KDE or any other desktop.
PLEASE NOTE: I believe the WG would really like to see KDE be a release blocking alternative DE under the premise that we can work together with the KDE team and get consensus on the technical aspects of what Workstation should provide. However, I did not want to put two issues in the same vote before we've really had a chance to discuss those technical aspects, so the proposal is only for the default DE choice. We will vote on alternative DEs at a later time.
For me, it's not so much about this or that desktop but about cross-desktop interoperability, e.g. through sane packaging standards that allow installing several desktops side by side without having them interfere. This was my original motivation to become a member of this WG and I am looking forward to the discussion.
Best regards, Christoph
On 02/14/2014 06:26 PM, Christoph Wickert wrote:
Frankly speaking I think this is not subject to discussion. KDE needs to remain a release blocking desktop. Improving our workstation product should not happen at the cost of KDE or any other desktop.
That should be fine KDE will be the only release blocking desktop since WG will have to handle that themselves ( or what ever DE ends up being voted as an WG product )
JBG
May I make a request? Due to legacy I think MATE because it's based on GNOME 2 should be included on that list. That way you have all of the GNOME bases covered.
On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 5:12 AM, "Jóhann B. Guðmundsson" <johannbg@gmail.com
wrote:
On 02/14/2014 06:26 PM, Christoph Wickert wrote:
Frankly speaking I think this is not subject to discussion. KDE needs to remain a release blocking desktop. Improving our workstation product should not happen at the cost of KDE or any other desktop.
That should be fine KDE will be the only release blocking desktop since WG will have to handle that themselves ( or what ever DE ends up being voted as an WG product )
JBG
-- desktop mailing list desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop
On Tue, 2014-02-18 at 07:31 -0500, Alex GS wrote:
May I make a request? Due to legacy I think MATE because it's based on GNOME 2 should be included on that list. That way you have all of the GNOME bases covered.
Alex, I appreciate your enthusiasm but I think for the "legacy" use case GNOME 3 Classic Mode covers this. We would end up having a redundant product if we ship both Classic Mode and MATE.
If you have specific ways in which Classic Mode can be improved, the desktop team is happy to gather feedback and see if we can do something about it.
On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 5:12 AM, "Jóhann B. Guðmundsson" johannbg@gmail.com wrote:
On 02/14/2014 06:26 PM, Christoph Wickert wrote: Frankly speaking I think this is not subject to discussion. KDE needs to remain a release blocking desktop. Improving our workstation product should not happen at the cost of KDE or any other desktop. That should be fine KDE will be the only release blocking desktop since WG will have to handle that themselves ( or what ever DE ends up being voted as an WG product ) JBG
Where's appropriate place to post feedback?
On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 8:19 AM, Alberto Ruiz aruiz@redhat.com wrote:
On Tue, 2014-02-18 at 07:31 -0500, Alex GS wrote:
May I make a request? Due to legacy I think MATE because it's based on GNOME 2 should be included on that list. That way you have all of the GNOME bases covered.
Alex, I appreciate your enthusiasm but I think for the "legacy" use case GNOME 3 Classic Mode covers this. We would end up having a redundant product if we ship both Classic Mode and MATE.
If you have specific ways in which Classic Mode can be improved, the desktop team is happy to gather feedback and see if we can do something about it.
On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 5:12 AM, "Jóhann B. Guðmundsson" johannbg@gmail.com wrote:
On 02/14/2014 06:26 PM, Christoph Wickert wrote: Frankly speaking I think this is not subject to discussion. KDE needs to remain a release blocking desktop. Improving our workstation product should not happen at the cost of KDE or any other desktop. That should be fine KDE will be the only release blocking desktop since WG will have to handle that themselves ( or what ever DE ends up being voted as an WG product ) JBG-- Greetings, Alberto Ruiz Engineering Manager - Desktop Applications Team Red Hat, Inc.
-- desktop mailing list desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop
Alberto Ruiz writes:
If you have specific ways in which Classic Mode can be improved, the desktop team is happy to gather feedback and see if we can do something about it.
Thanks for asking! Please let me chip in with a list of items which are important to me. I am not sure if the list is complete, maybe others can help complete it.
1. Showstopper problems:
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=746462
(Note: Although few people seem to be working in this dual monitor configuration, it makes Gnome/Gnome classic a personal no-go for me as I have gotten very used to working in dual-screen in this way and will not want to give it up. Bug is still present in F20, although it's been auto-closed long ago. It's a bug after all, so why not fix it...)
2. Things that are not really showstoppers, but where cinnamon in direct comparision is ahead, and which would be much missed:
* Right-click menu on task bar (as back in Gnome 2) * Configurable vertical maximize (or better a good default binding for vertical maximize) * Optional or default bottom task/menubar only (more natural for working in configurations like item 1 above, also on modern 16x9 displays, the vertical space is much more precious than it was back in the 4x3 era, while horizontal space is not an issue with current monitor resolutions)
3. Crazy ideas/nice to have/food for thought:
I posted the following his list, see bottom of mail in link: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/desktop/2013-December/008530.html Summary:
* Right-click launching of applications from desktop (reason: controlled positioning of windows) * Confluence of CLI and file browser * Hierarchical taskbar/window hierarchy
All items to improve workflows with many/big screens, mixture of CLI/GUI work, large number of open windows
I very much appreciate the steering committee's decision to go with current Gnome, which appears the only sustainable choice, and I hope that it will develop to a state that it is competitive or winning in every category that is important for productive work. I don't think it's missing much, but see list above...
--Marcel
On Wed, Feb 19, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Marcel Oliver m.oliver@jacobs-university.de wrote:
Showstopper problems:
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=746462
(Note: Although few people seem to be working in this dual monitor configuration, it makes Gnome/Gnome classic a personal no-go for me as I have gotten very used to working in dual-screen in this way and will not want to give it up. Bug is still present in F20, although it's been auto-closed long ago. It's a bug after all, so why not fix it...)
Heh, to our defense: this behavior is as "classic" as it can get, as it was inherited from the GNOME2 days [0].
On a more serious note, the issue is tracked both upstream[1] and downstream[2], I still hope to fix it in time for 3.12.0.
- Configurable vertical maximize (or better a good default binding for vertical maximize)
Uhm - "Settings->Keyboard->Shortcuts->Windows->Maximize window vertically"?
[0] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=750142 [1] https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=663690 [2] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1046149
+1
----- Original Message -----
I'm calling for a vote on the default DE used as a base for the Workstation Product. The overall discussion seems to have played out, so let's get things settled. As the subject says, I'm proposing we use GNOME as the default base of the product. WG members have one week from today to vote or counter-propose. Missing votes after one week will be counted as abstains.
PLEASE NOTE: I believe the WG would really like to see KDE be a release blocking alternative DE under the premise that we can work together with the KDE team and get consensus on the technical aspects of what Workstation should provide. However, I did not want to put two issues in the same vote before we've really had a chance to discuss those technical aspects, so the proposal is only for the default DE choice. We will vote on alternative DEs at a later time.
Thanks!
josh
Dne 14.2.2014 14:44, Josh Boyer napsal(a):
I'm calling for a vote on the default DE used as a base for the Workstation Product. The overall discussion seems to have played out, so let's get things settled. As the subject says, I'm proposing we use GNOME as the default base of the product. WG members have one week from today to vote or counter-propose. Missing votes after one week will be counted as abstains. PLEASE NOTE: I believe the WG would really like to see KDE be a release blocking alternative DE under the premise that we can work together with the KDE team and get consensus on the technical aspects of what Workstation should provide. However, I did not want to put two issues in the same vote before we've really had a chance to discuss those technical aspects, so the proposal is only for the default DE choice. We will vote on alternative DEs at a later time.
I welcome the initiative for other desktops to peacefully coexist alongside the default offering. So plus one from me
On Fri, 2014-02-14 at 08:44 -0500, Josh Boyer wrote:
I'm calling for a vote on the default DE used as a base for the Workstation Product. The overall discussion seems to have played out, so let's get things settled. As the subject says, I'm proposing we use GNOME as the default base of the product. WG members have one week from today to vote or counter-propose. Missing votes after one week will be counted as abstains.
I'm voting +1 on this.
On Wed, Feb 19, 2014 at 9:04 AM, Jens Petersen petersen@redhat.com wrote:
[...] I do hope that gnome-shell resource performance could be improved though.
We have been doing that since 3.0 if you have something specific please file a bug ... but that's OT so lets take it elsewhere (upstream bugzilla ;) )
On Wed, Feb 19, 2014 at 3:04 AM, Jens Petersen petersen@redhat.com wrote:
I'm proposing we use GNOME as the default base of the product.
Sure +1
Great! I think with that vote we've got unanimous agreement among the WG members. Thanks everyone, and one to the next item.
josh
desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org
-
Alberto Ruiz -
Alex G.S. -
Christian Schaller -
Christoph Wickert -
drago01 -
Florian Müllner -
Jens-Ulrik Petersen -
Josh Boyer -
Jóhann B. Guðmundsson -
Kalev Lember -
Lukáš Tinkl -
Marcel Oliver -
Matthias Clasen -
Owen Taylor -
Ryan Lerch